Minna! Konnichiwa! Kore wa Robbie no shousetsu. Houtoni totemo tanoshimi ni shite iru! Tanoshinde kudasai!
Translation: Everyone! Hello! This is the story of Robbie. I am really excited. Please enjoy.
I briefly met Robbie in the summer of 2007 via a 3-way phone conversation. She is best friends with Vol. 03's guest, The Pastry Chef, who also chose to remain anonymous. The fact that these friends decided to do so illustrates how much is and can be at stake for Black queer people. Unveiling this particular aspect can ruin families, businesses, careers, and even lead to death.
But that's not what this conversation is about. Robbie is the 2nd Black trans-woman featured and is the 4th trans-person I've communicated with. It's an honor that she decided to sit down and share pieces of her journey.
Because she lives in Florida, we conducted this over the phone. For 2 hours, no joke, we talked, laughed, and became friends. I appreciated her openness to give ALL the details, though they all couldn't fit into this interview.
She's gone to Japan and speaks fluent Japanese. I'm jealous. [laughs] She draws, plays video games, loves music, and is incredibly intelligent. Although she hasn't yet, I know when she decides to disclose her trans identity, she, like Noah, will break countless barriers in modeling.
What stands out about this piece, to me, is how much of myself I revealed, and how much we have in common.
Jya, hajimemashou ka? Well, shall we begin? Welcome to Season 03 | Vol. 23 of the Modern Queer.
Xzavier V. Simon
I’m doing okay. I’ve been using this time, cause I’m still not working, to think about my future What I want to be, what I want to do
That introspection is critical. So, last season I interviewed Xorianna, and she taught me a lot about trans-identity. I asked if she identified as trans to which she said, ‘no, I am trans. I am a woman.’ My first question is, how do you identify, and do you feel the same?
I see myself as a woman. That’s what people who know me see me as. However, I am very aware of how society sees trans-woman. I’m also very aware that I will never be a biological woman, and I’m not trying to take their place. I’m not trying to steal their identity as some cis-gender women feel. I see myself as a woman, but I am a trans-woman. I may not like it. I may not choose to disclose that information, but I'm very aware of that’s who I am. It affects my life every day, and I know that all trans women know that too We want to be seen and respected as women, and that’s what we’re fighting for If we must assimilate into society, we’re going to be like, we’re women and respect us You get what I mean?
I get what you mean. If we’re going to participate in this show, this is how I want to be defined. I’ve only sat down and talked to you and three other trans people in my 30 years. I know how it feels to be disrespected, and so I want to take the time to be as respectful as possible.
Of course. This is really appreciated. It’s good that you are covering different spectrums. As you’re going to learn in this interview, and I read the other interview, all our experiences are different.
Of course. This is really appreciated. It’s good that you are covering different spectrums. As you’re going to learn in this interview, and I read the other interview, all our experiences are different
I wanted to interview trans people to give balance and learn. There were way too many niggas wanting to be a part of this. I get it, but our experience does not make up the totality of this spectrum. We don't get shit in the way that trans-people get it. Also, as a Black queer man, I have privilege. I recognize, understand, and want to utilize that privilege to open doors for all of us.
I agree. I completely agree.
Well, that got deep quick. [laughs] Before we get into all of that, let’s talk about growing up.
At the time, I was raised in a two-parent household, and I have two older brothers. Contrary to popular belief about how gay people or trans people typically take on feminine characteristics from their family or their mothers, I was, for most of my life as a child, surrounded by a lot of men
Interesting.
I feel like that’s where my story differs a lot When I was young, I gravitated to feminine things. Growing up, my brothers loved video games and anime, and that’s how I got into it.
I’m here for this already! [laughs]
[laughs] I remember watching them play video games and watching them do all these things, but I gravitated to the female characters. The first time my brother started to suspect something a little weird about me, he played a Final Fantasy game.
"IfellinlovewiththePinkRanger.Shewas everythingtome.Shewassuperfeminine,pink, pretty,andeverythingthatIlovedaboutbeing feminine."
"My dad said, ‘lemme ask you a question. are you a boy or a girl?'"
You could name the character, and I wanted him to name me as one of the female characters. He was like, ‘why do you want to be one of the female characters?’ It didn't register to me at that time, the idea of gender, that boys are supposed to do this, girls are supposed to do this, and you can’t be this way because of this I was probably three, four years old Then Powers Rangers came out
Taking it back to the 90s.
I fell in love with the Pink Ranger. She was everything to me. She was super feminine, pink, pretty, and everything that I loved about being feminine. She could also fight and stand up for herself. She was my role model. That's when my dad started to get a little worried. I think he tried to like to read it off as a crush, but he quickly learned that that wasn't the case afterward. [laughs]
[laughs] I bet he did.
I remember I would start putting on the clothes that I had grew out of My old shorts were shorter, and my shirts were tighter At school, I got girl toys from my friends in class I would lie about why, and I started bringing that stuff home I had this fairy Barbie doll that I got, and my mom ended up finding it
Oooooo, this getting deep.
Yes. My dad took me into his room and sat me down. He said, ‘lemme ask you a question. Are you a boy or a girl?’ I’ll never forget that as a five, six-year-old that he asked me these questions. I told him, ‘I think I’m a girl.’ He was like, ‘I understand how you feel, but that's not the case. I think you’re confused about the fact that you like these things. I think you think that these are things that only girls like.’
Wow. I can’t even imagine that! That’s not the response I was expecting at all.
My dad was very progressive in the sense that it’s okay for boys to like feminine things But you needed to know the difference between liking things that are feminine and being a woman He was always trying to make that distinction for me when I was younger
I think that’s a good distinction to have.
When my brothers played sports, a lot of times, they wouldn’t let me play. Then the other boys treated me the same way. I felt isolated. On one end, my dad is telling me it’s okay. But because I don’t fit the stereotype of what a man is, I don’t fit in with them. Well, where do I belong? Where do I fit in? That kind of sums up my youth.
Although our experiences are different, I can relate to that feeling of not belonging. I felt isolated because my interests and hobbies were foreign to everyone else. They listened to Aaliyah and Ginuwine, and I’m over here bumping the ending themes to Inu-Yasha. [laughs] It messed up my identity and sense of self-worth.
Yeah And at that age, you want to fit in You want to feel a part of anything
I think that’s because, as children, we intuitively know that we are a part of everything. A piece of ourselves is forming, and instead of being taught to stand firm in ourselves, we look to others for validation. But to that moment with your father, the amount of patience and understanding…I wouldn’t have expected at all from somebodies’ father. [laughs]
[laughs] I didn’t understand that either. When I was getting my master’s degree, I lived with my father. We talked a lot about my childhood.
He told me my brother asked him if I was a boy or girl. That day my father knew that this was going to be my struggle in life.
Crazy to think about.
Don’t get me wrong; he was not happy about it and didn’t accept me either It took him years, but he was mentally prepared by the time I was conscious enough to start making those connections and asking questions
How is your relationship with him and your brothers now?
Me and my father have a good relationship. Me and my brothers on the other hand...it's kinda weird. In middle school, both of my brothers still lived at home. I had a decent life. I can't complain. In 10th grade, one of my best friends committed suicide, and then in 11th grade, my parents divorced. That same year my middle brother, who's adopted, was going through this phase questioning who his [birth] parents were. He got into a lot of trouble with the law and ended up getting kicked out of the house and was trying to do drugs on the street and stuff like that All of that happened to me in the span of two years
Got damn!
[laughs] I'm trying to make this quick, cause I don't want to take up all your time.
I got the time!
It's weird because I feel like I'm telling you all my problems. [laughs]
[laughs] No, this is just who I am. I love to listen to people’s stories to get a feel for who they are and what they’ve experienced. When I was in high school, and it came out that I liked men they hung my ass out to dry! [laughs] It took me 8 years after that to accept it and let it go.
It was a tough time for me. I was so confused but it’s interesting that niggas do “gay” shit all the time but have the gall to make fun of queer people.
100% agree It’s the truth Men have this conflict of trying to prove how masculine they are and spend their whole lives trying to prove this point that means nothing
Absolutely nothing. But, identifying as a male myself, and trying to live the standard traditional male experience, I get it but damn.
And consider you’re an African American male. It’s very critical, very important when you speak about your experiences.
It colors everything! [laughs] I’m trying to figure out what does it mean to be gay. My uncle and people at school are harping about how to be a man. That it cannot deviate from this standard, which is already fucked up, because if it does, we’re automatically going to call it gay.
That’s right
For a long time, I didn’t see myself as masculine. I learned and accepted this through my interactions with heterosexual women, who loved to be around me, and feminine gay men attracted to me. [laughs] This masculine inferiority complex, my queerness, and me watching shows like Sailor Moon [laughs] all contributed to this internal confusion.
Yup! Yup! I love Sailor Moon! [laughs]
[laughs] All this made me wonder, ‘does this not make me a man?’
And how does this make me less than anybody else?
And how does this disregard my Blackness?
Yeah, I was trying not to go there. [laughs]
[laughs] You love Japanese animation and video games too, so I know you understand. You grow up in the hood, you grow up around Black folk who aren’t watching and doing this kind of stuff, which makes you feel alien. You’re putting anime wallpapers on your desktop background! [laughs]
[laughs] Yes! Watching music videos!
Right! Living your best life, but to everybody else, it's like what are you doing? You're not Black. You're not a man. You're not a woman. You're not one of us. It confusing as hell. Within these last three, four years, I got comfortable in myself.
In college, I needed to remove myself from the Black community for a little while Not that I didn't support it, but I needed to remove myself from the emotional stress and trauma that I received from my own community. My major was Japanese, so I spent a lot of time around Asian people.
That was my major too before I went into education. [laughs]
[laughs] The way they treat masculinity and femininity within their race and culture was vastly different. There was this one Asian guy who sat with his legs crossed, his clothes were tight, but he was straight, and he was getting hella hoes. [laughs] I remember thinking, ‘his pants are kind of tight, and why is he sitting with his legs crossed? Is he gay?’ I found myself having the stereotypes Black people think about what is masculine and what is gay That's when I took a step back, and said, wow, we are conditioned
Yes, we are.
I'm glad to have that experience. When I went back to the Black community, I went as a different person with a different perspective. I learned, especially when I lived in Japan, that the little world we grew up in isn't the whole world It doesn’t equate to our quality of life, whether I’m Black or not It took me a long time to get there, and it took me separating myself and coming back This small perception of what you have and think for Black people could be so much more So, I get where you’re coming from.
I had that same moment in 2017. I needed to leave everything and everybody. I felt trapped, so I got on the road. It was God and me like what it did do baybee! [laughs]
[laughs] Let’s do it What we finna do!
It was hard, but looking back on it now, was one of the best experiences of my life for precisely those reasons. Your hometown is a little bubble. You think that this bubble is it.
That's what you think. This is your whole world.
I met so many phenomenal people, got a chance to teach, and learn from kids all over the world. Not only that, to be able to see different kinds of Black people, that's what hit me.
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes
Some people were like, ‘you remind me of back home.’ Other people dressed in ways that folk in my hometown would’ve called gay. People did not find my anime-loving, Kpop/J-pop blasting ass weird. [laughs] It gave greater appreciation and respect for myself and my difference So, switching gears, when did start the process of transitioning? From my understanding, for Black trans people, that process can be very discriminating and demeaning, if they can get that to process at all.
" T h i s s m a l l p e r c e p t i o n o f w h a t y o u h a v e a n d t h i n k f o r B l a c k p e o p l e c o u l d b e s o m u c h m o r e . "
"Iborrowedawigfromafriend,andIletthemdomy makeupinthemorning.Thatdaychangedmylife."
When I got to high school, I tried to make myself more masculine to the best of my ability. It didn’t work too well, but I tried. [laughs] Eventually, I just stopped caring I wouldn’t buy any clothes I didn’t care how I looked During homecoming week, we had this thing called Wacky Wednesday, and usually, a lot of the athletes dressed up as girls
[sighs] Keep going because I don’t wanna turn this into another moment like before. [laughs]
Right. We ain't gonna talk about that. [laughs] That year I said if the athletes do it, why can’t I. Me and the girl I was dating at the time, decided to dress up as cats. We wore matching outfits. I borrowed a wig from a friend, and I let them do my makeup in the morning. That day changed my life. I walked in class, and everybody’s like, ‘you look so much like a girl.’ People were freaking out. I remember thinking, wait a minute. I might be on to something. [laughs]
You looked in that mirror and saw the truth! [laughs]
[laughs] I discovered what was going on My friend let me keep that wig and I’m thankful cause that was my hair for a long time
[laughs] Yaassss.
Someone ended up calling my mom like, ‘have you seen your son?’ I didn’t leave home, how I came home. My mom wasn’t too happy about that, but I was like everybody else does it. It was the perfect time But I didn’t think I was gonna end up looking as pretty as I did They did my makeup, and I said this what we do now [laughs] I started borrowing girl jeans, including my girlfriend's She was strangely supportive now that I think about it
She sounds supportive! And so, you are taking hormones, correct?
Yes, I am You have to for the rest of your life
Have you had any surgeries?
I had my breasts done in 2013, 2014 I was in college, and I joined a sorority That was my first time being around girls so much They talked about implants and all this other stuff, and I was like crap, I need to get with the program. I saved all my financial aid, and I got my breast done.
That’s dedication! You've had other surgeries done too.
Yes, I have. I wanted to get the rest of the features in my face that were masculine. I ended up getting my nose done. Last year I finally got the SRS surgery.
SRS stands for Sexual Reassignment Surgery. Wow! Congratulations. [claps] How was the medical process?
Hills in the road! [laughs] Bumps don’t give it the justice it needs to have I got the surgery last year in March in California I was there for a month, and for that entire month, I could not walk The only way I could get anywhere was if my boyfriend took me or he went to get it for me.
I can’t imagine the pain you were feeling.
I came back home, and I couldn’t walk for another month. I think it was eight weeks before I could walk. When I say walk, I mean get up to go to the bathroom. After about two months, I was able to kind of get around the house by myself. I work in a foreign language environment, so I don’t use English at work. Can you imagine, you’re on heavy painkillers trying to keep up with a second language while trying to act like you didn’t just have major surgery
[laughs] Oh my god!
By month eight is when the pain finally started to subside, which is very late for people Normally people start to feel better around month three I was on pain medication for at least six, seven months
And here you are today!
I somehow survived [laughs]
Going back to something you mentioned, and this is totally for my enjoyment by the way. [laughs and fanboys] You went to college, got your degree in Japanese, and went to Japan. That has been a dream of mines and is probably the dream of Black otakus. How was that experience?
I wanted to write music for Japanese video games. That style of music really inspired me.
Oh my god!! Video game RPG music is the shit!
When I graduated, I was like, I need to go to the country and see if I like it I worked three part-time jobs for seven months
Damn! You had goals.
I barely got any sleep I was able to save up enough money to stay in Japan for six weeks. I was able to find this place that housed foreigners if you spoke Japanese. They got me an apartment set up. All I had to do when I got to Japan was get the key. It was crazy. Got on a plane, for the first time, and went all the way to Japan.
Shit! Pause the interview. Here come the tears. I love it. You love to see it. [laughs]
On my left side [on the plane] was a Hispanic American girl, and on my right was a Japanese girl who didn’t speak English at all.
I sat the whole flight translating. Got to Japan, I had one of my Japanese friends meet me to show me how to get a train card and that kind of stuff I stayed in Tokyo
[squeals] Tell me everything!!
[laughs] I went into the world of Japan You go from my small hometown to Tokyo; I was full of tears I was like, ‘am I actually here?’ You’re walking down the street with big buildings with screens and anime characters and Japanese pop music. It's an unbelievable experience. You see people from around the world. Everybody is so driven, and everybody has goals and dreams. Everybody has that determined mindset to change their life. That’s the vibe I got. Anytime you meet somebody, you’re guaranteed an interesting story. I didn’t have any plans. I met some people who were DJs. Then I wrote a song for them. [laughs]
We stan forever!! [laughs] Do you feel Japan was a liberating experience?
Oh yeah! The biggest thing about being in Tokyo, by myself, was I was able to live life for the first time without thinking about the fact that I’m trans I think more than any other experience I’ve ever had, that probably is the most mind-blowing one for me The whole time I was there, I was able to forget that I was trans. It didn’t come up.
Fuck! I got more tears. [laughs] Yup, I felt that. It reminds me of this YouTube channel called Black in Asia. A lot of different kinds of Black folk talk about feeling free in Asia. That's a priceless feeling. But, to stop me from crying [laughs], you have some bombass modeling photos! I wish y’all could see them because they are incredible. How did modeling start?
That started in Japan. I was walking in Harajuku, which is the fashion district. This particular day, I felt like being fashionable and super cute I was walking, and this guy came up to me and looked kind of panicked He started talking to me in really fast Japanese
I understood what he said, but I didn’t know how to respond politely because Japanese has different levels of speaking He said, 'I’m an intern at this modeling agency, and I’m trying to get bonus points. I can get bonus points if I can get some shots of a foreigner.' We talked, and we agreed to do a photoshoot. The crazy thing was he paid me $500.
Damn!
It’s all coincidental. I got lucky because on the news that morning, they announced that a group of models was coming from different countries for this competition that they were doing in Tokyo. The guy thought I was one of the girls, and that’s why he offered me so much money
Oh my god, I’m fucking dying!! [laughs]
It's crazy
[laughs] Naw that just means you were meant to be a model. Spirit decreed it on that day in Tokyo.
It was my first time, but I’m a dancer too so to me, it’s kinda the same thing. We did the photoshoot, and the pictures were gorgeous. He took them to his agency, and they contacted through Instagram. I did some small fashion shows. I let them put me in one of their magazines. They ended up offering me a Visa to stay a little bit longer.
Girl, you are legendary!!
[laughs] I ended up staying another five weeks working until I had to go back to America cause I had gotten into graduate school
I'm gonna keep saying this, cause if you don't know, I'm gonna let you know today! The universe, God, spirit, the ancestors got you! That's incredible.
I got really lucky
Lucky? Girl, you are blessed and highly favored you better come on. Don't even try to be humble with me.
[laughs]
Anyway [laughs] you are in a relationship with, let me sip my drink, a very handsome Asian man.
That's my baby.
How did y'all meet?
I wanted to get involved in the modeling community. I joined a modeling Facebook group, and he’s a photographer. He takes a lot of my pictures. There’s an event where photographers and models get together and network He was there, and obviously, I thought he was cute [laughs]
[sips drink and laughs] Grab the popcorn y’all!
We took some pictures together, and it went well We hung out a few times, and we clicked. Things were going smoothly, but because of the nature of how we met and our relationship, I didn't want to tell him that I was trans. We hung out for like a few weeks before I told him.
We ain’t mad at you.
"Being in To��o, for the first time, [I forgot] about the fact that I’m trans. "
"I’m proud of myself. I worked hard to be here."
I ended up in a situation where I could not get hormones because my doctor was in the city where I went to college. [My boyfriend] offered to take me He knew I needed the medication, but he didn’t know what kind
I bet he didn’t! [laughs]
This was a long drive, and I felt bad having him take me I had a crush on him, and I didn’t want him to think it was something he should be worried about. I don’t know. [laughs]
[laughs] I got you, girl. You just wanted to be safe, honest, and have no drama.
I invited him over, and I had to get drunk because I couldn’t do it sober. I was like you should probably know that this happened to me because of this. That’s how I told him.
That sounds like you laid it on a little bit thick. [laughs]
[laughs] I did. I was upset and telling him not to leave me ‘You don’t have to talk to me tomorrow, but don’t leave me right now ’ He stayed, and that morning, he said we’re going to talk about everything after you get home from work I’ll pick you up from work, and we can talk about it
The popcorn is still here.
He showed up, and we talked. He, before me, did not have a lot of knowledge about the LGBTQ community. He didn’t have any biases, but he didn’t know what to think. One thing about our relationship is that he learned a lot about oppressed groups. He didn’t grow up in America. He didn’t come here to stay until he was a teenager. That’s why he was able to handle it better than the typical guy.
Again legendary. [laughs] So, we’re almost to the end of this, and I must know, who is Robbie today? The 2020 version.
I would say that Robbie is now a girl who wants to live her life no differently than any other girl I’m a girl who has found her place in society and realized that it doesn’t have to be in those same square boxes that everybody else tries to put things and that it’s okay You don’t have to be accepted by everybody You may not live to see a time where people are completely accepted, but I plan on living a life where who I am doesn’t hinder me, but if anything, it helps.
I’ll drink to that.
I’m proud of myself I worked hard to be here
And you should be. Listening to your story, laughing, and I don’t even know you like that, but I’m proud of you. I’m happy to see the growth and how far you’ve come. You’ve done a lot of things that I want to do. You have tremendous strength and a beautiful spirit. Plus, you’re best friends with my best friend, which means we best friends. [laughs]
Thank you! [laughs]
I'm humbled. Thank you so much for agreeing to be a part of this. For telling your story, inspiring other people to live in their truth and be who they are.
I appreciate you letting little old me tell my story [laughs]
Girl, you’re legendary!! Now I gotta go get myself something to eat. I have laughed, cried, and now I'm hungry. It was a pleasure. An absolute pleasure.
Thank you for this gift.
