Sun, Temperature, CO2, Oceans, Freshwater
Cycle, Infrared Radiation, CO2, Water Vapor, Clouds
John Shanahan
November 6, 2025
Invited discussion participants:
- Hans Achermann, Engineer, Switzerland
- Walter Aeberli, Engineer, Switzerland
- Simon Aegerter, Physicist, Switzerland
- Irene Aegerter, Physicist, Women in Nuclear, Switzerland
- Russ Babcock, Biochemist, Canada
- Ed Berry, Atmospheric Physicist, USA
- Erik Bye, Physical Chemist, Norway,
- Terigi Ciccone, Engineer, USA
- Bruno Comby, Engineer, France
- Geert de Vries, Physicist, South Africa
- Samuel Furfari, Energy Expert to the European Union
- Michael Hancock, Computer Scientist, USA
- William Happer, Physicist, USA
- Howard Cork Hayden, Physicist, USA
- Vijay Jayaraj, Engineer and Environmental Scientist, India
- Demetris Koutsoyiannis, Engineer, Greece
- C (Kees) le Pair, Physicist, Netherlands
- Douglas Lightfoot, Engineer, Canada
- Richard Lindzen, Atmospheric Physicist, USA
- Jennifer Marohasy, Marine Biologist, Australia
- Patrick Moore, Ecologist, Canada
- Gerald Ratzer, Computer Scientist, Physicist, Canada
- Willie Soon, Astrophysicist, USA
- Ronald Stein, Fossil Fuels and By-Products, USA
- Thorpe Watson, Mining and Metallurgy Scientist, Canada
- Uli Weber, Geophysicist, Germany
- William van Wijngaarden, Physicist, Canada
- Gregory Wrightstone, Geologist, USA
- Valentina Zharkova, physicist, UK
Go to comments
Dear friends and colleagues interested in nuclear energy, fossil fuels, their by-products, and climate science,
Erik Bye, a physical chemist in Norway, posted this: It is the Sun.
Simon Aegerter, a physicist in Switzerland, replied with this graph.
Updated from: Lockwood, L; Frohlich, C (October 2007), “Recent oppositely directed trends in solar climate forcings and the global mean surface air temperature” Proceedings of the Royal Society A. 4633 (2086), 2447-2460.
Simon Aegerter advises the world that:
1) Man-made carbon dioxide in the atmosphere drives global warming from the use of fossil fuels. We can control manmade global warming, man-made sea level rise, and manmade changes in the weather by limiting the use of fossil fuels and sequestering CO2.
2) The sun is not the major driver of Earth's temperature increase. Rather, it is the “greenhouse” effect of infrared radiation from warmer oceans and land that acts on atmospheric CO2.
You have been a part of energy and climate change discussions for many years. My background is in civil structural engineering with 30 years of studying Earth's long climate history, change in the weather and climate in the last two hundred years, and climate models. You are climate experts and have your own knowledge on man-made global warming, man-made climate change, etc.
With limited knowledge of weather science on this water planet, here are my thoughts. Please tell me where you think I am wrong and what you think of the above graph and the related claims.
Please keep discussions limited to science and avoid derogatory language.
1) Basic science says that a graph of three lines proves nothing about the relations of the three lines.
2) Man-made carbon dioxide is chemically identical to natural carbon dioxide. If natural carbon dioxide is essential for life and not a pollutant, man-made carbon dioxide is the same.
3) In a closed volume of water and atmosphere, the increase of atmospheric carbon dioxide follows an increase in water temperature and vice versa. Not the other way around as climate change alarmists claim.
4) Infrared radiation from solar-warmed land and ocean surfaces does not energize tiny amounts of carbon dioxide molecules in the atmosphere enough to cause significant global warming of the atmosphere and oceans.
5) The Principle of Conservation of Energy requires that weather events, ocean and air currents, and the freshwater cycle (which are often totally ignored) reduce Infrared Radiation in the lower atmosphere. Weather phenomena release IR in the upper atmosphere and higher latitudes to send energy to space and keep Earth cool. The full energy from the sun-warmed land and ocean surfaces isn't available as infrared radiation at lower elevations to act on CO2. Weather phenomena and ocean and atmospheric currents mean less IR in the lower atmosphere. There are many reasons why atmospheric CO2, particularly "man-made" carbon dioxide, does not cause catastrophic global warming, sea level rise, or changes in weather patterns. Weather and climate are natural phenomena that have existed for a billion years.
6) There is no closed greenhouse effect in the open atmosphere of Earth.
7) The sun is the major heating source for the Earth. Variations of its orbit, tilt, and solar energy output are the main causes of climate change in shorter time periods.
8) The natural tendency is for CO2 to become sequestered in sediments that turn to rock. Human sequestering of CO2 is a tremendous waste of precious energy and pointless regard to climate change.
9) Weather and climate are well within historical ranges.
10) Man-made global warming, etc., etc., is a political hoax, not related to weather and climate in nature.
If you are interested in commenting on the above graph and the statements here, we will compile your comments for publication in an article on allaboutenergy.net.
NOTE: Discussions on this subject fail because of unprofessional and unscientific language. You have shown that you have constructive ideas and use professional language.
Go to comments
Thanks for your interest and participation.
John A. Shanahan Civil Engineer Denver, Colorado, USA
E-mail:
john.shanahan@allaboutenergy.net
Website: allaboutenergy.net
Earth is a water planet. This can not be ignored.
Life thrives in the oceans, on land, and in the sky.
Natural and man-made carbon dioxide are essential for life. Manmade CO2 is not a pollutant.
Man-made global warming alarmists want the world to live without reliable electricity, energy for cooking, heating, air conditioning, communications, the Internet, education for all, transportation, and the by-products from fossil fuels.
How far will the alarmists go with their demands? How long will
biomass fuels last before forests and wildlife habitats are gone, and most of the wildlife is eaten? Do you like eating grasshoppers?