Dazarreon

Columbia INCITE | Oral History_Sergio_Dazarreon [SIDE CONVERSATION] Q:

Today's date is Monday, March 4th. My name is Sergio Muniz from Black and Latino Male Achievement, and I am interviewing--

EDWARDS:

Dazarreon Edwards.

Q:

Dazarreon Edwards, do I have permission to record this interview for the 2019 Portrait Project?

EDWARDS:

Yes.

Q:

OK, we'll begin. Tell me about the most memorable childhood experience you can recall.

EDWARDS:

Actually, me hurting my leg. I was at this daycare, and I was playing basketball. It was nighttime. And they boy had rolled into the alley. I was chasing it, and I fell. And I thought I just scraped my knee, but really a piece, like-- I don't know what it was-- but it was something hard and sharp. And it had went in my leg. And I thought I just scraped my knee, and I pulled up my pants, and I seen it was a fat hole in my leg. And I just panicked.

Q:

What did you do after that?

EDWARDS:

We had went to the hospital, and they had stitched it up and everything.

Q:

What is it-- is that most recently? Is that recent or?

EDWARDS:

Yeah, that was recent.

Q:

OK. Tell me something about your life. Where were you born?

EDWARDS:

I was born here in Milwaukee. We had moved up to Appleton, Wisconsin for three years, then we came back here.

Q:

OK. How was that for you?

EDWARDS:

Like, Appleton, Wisconsin is small. There's really barely anything there. I was born and raised here for like half half my life. Then we moved up there for a couple of years and came back.

Q:

What are some of the differences you noticed?

EDWARDS:

It is way smaller than here. There's not too many black men there. It's mainly Caucasian people, stuff like that. It's basically more of them than us.

Q:

Do you feel any type of way about that?

EDWARDS:

Not at all, nah-uh. Because I'm not like a racist person. I'm not racist at all.

Q:

But what's that like being here in Milwaukee then, around more people?

EDWARDS:

It's way more violence here than there.

Q:

You said, "more violence?"

EDWARDS:

Way more violent here.

Q:

Tell me a little bit about that.

EDWARDS:

Like, up there, it's quiet. It's quiet, peaceful sound. You don't have all them high-speed chases and stuff happening here. No, none of that happened down there. It's peaceful.

Q:

Thinking about your early life, what are some the things that you would want to tell people?

EDWARDS:

Like to encourage them?

Q:

Just early in your life, stuff like that, you know, people don't really know about you or just stuff that you would like to share with the world.

EDWARDS:

Make good choices. Definitely make good choices. Don't be smoking, doing none of that. Go to school, get your education.

Q:

Do you have a story that may have brought about those thoughts, or like, for you to believe that?

EDWARDS:

Yes, I got expelled from two schools in less than a month.

Q:

Do you want to talk about that?

EDWARDS:

I was going to Walker Memphis Heights Academy, I was just getting suspended. And they expelled me. And then I went to this Lutheran school, and I was there for maybe a week, and got expelled from there. And that's when I came here. And I was like, I gotta turn this around.

I'm like, I can't be doing this. Like doing this, it's going to be following me. I just decided to turn

it around. People who were saying, oh, you're not going to make it to sixth grade and you ain't going to make it to seventh grade. And look at where I'm at now. I'm in seventh grade.

Q:

How did you feel when people would say those things?

EDWARDS:

I mean, it didn't used to hurt me at all because I knew I was going to make it. It didn't hurt me at all.

Q:

But did it affect you in any type of way?

EDWARDS:

Nah-uh.

Q:

No? You just kind of disregarded what people said? Cool. OK, so who have been the most important people in your life? How do they describe you? So thinking about your family, your friends, teachers, the community.

EDWARDS:

The most important people in my life right now are my siblings, my mom, and my dad, my whole family basically, people that encourage me, my teacher, for helping me get to the next grade. And in less than a year, I'll be in high school. Just the people that encouraged me to do right.

Q:

And how would they describe you?

EDWARDS:

Like, my teacher, she'd describe me as smart, funny, goofy. I'm just like a goofy person.

Q:

What about your family?

EDWARDS:

The same way.

Q:

Same way? How do you think people perceive you? How do you think the rest of the world sees you, besides the people that are most connected with you?

EDWARDS:

I don't know, because I don't really be out the house. I'll be in the house all the time, playing a game or something.

Q:

How do you think that people perceive youth, or perceive your neighborhood, or perceive youth of color in Milwaukee?

EDWARDS:

Some people out here be racists. Like some of these police officers, you'll go dig for your wallet, and they'll think you're going for a gun, and just shoot you. Like, it's just crazy

nowadays. When all of that stuff started happening, when they started burning down stuff, that stuff was crazy. The gas station that they burned down, that could have took out a whole block.

Q:

How does that make you feel, if you're having those beliefs?

EDWARDS:

I don't know. It just made me believe that I could do more stuff than I think I could do.

Q:

What else do you think about Milwaukee?

EDWARDS:

If Milwaukee could stop the violence, and maybe all this shooting, and all that type of stuff, this would be actually somewhere people could-- this could be like a go-to city, I mean, a go-to state. Because most people want to go to Vegas, Florida, Texas, and all them places. Not once do people think about Detroit, Chicago, Illinois, none of those places. Like, we're the eye of violence right now. If something, like say, if Vegas shooters go all the way up the radar, people going to be looking like, I don't want to go to Vegas no more. I don't want to do this.

And then, there you go.

Q:

You think that Milwaukee has that problem right now?

EDWARDS:

Oh, definitely.

Q:

That's interesting. So what has stood out to you about yourself throughout your life?

EDWARDS:

All my life I always knew I wasn't an adorable kid. Like, when I was younger, I always was like, a bigger kid. Like, I always was taller than most of the kids in my class. I was always kind of bigger. I always had maybe bigger feet. Like right now, I'm wearing a size 13.

Q:

Has that had any advantages or challenges for you?

EDWARDS:

Like most people may think, oh, he gonna play football. Like, I love football, basketball. I like them sports But maybe one day, I might just try something new like tennis or golf or something.

Q:

OK. What do you believe-- what makes you, you?

EDWARDS:

I really don't even know what makes me? I don't know. I could be happy one moment, then mad, then happy. I don't know what makes me, me. I'm still figuring that out, man. Most people are like I'm this, I'm that. You never know, you might discover something new one day.

Q:

And that's OK. As Johanna mentions, you know, people could be in their 40s and still figuring out who they are. So how do you describe yourself when people talk about you, or when people ask you about you?

EDWARDS:

People call me fat and other stuff like that. That don't hurt me. Words don't hurt me. That's just stuff coming out your mouth. Them words. As long as you ain't touching me, hurting me, we're cool.

Q:

Ah huh. How would you describe yourself?

EDWARDS:

Dazarreon. I describe myself as me.

Q:

I like that. What are your dreams for the future?

EDWARDS:

Hopefully make it to the NFL.

Q:

You want to tell me a little more about that? What brought about those desires?

EDWARDS:

When I started actually playing tackle football, that just, like I was having fun doing that, just out there on the field, straight up tackling people, just straight up hitting people. In football, between football and basketball, I choose football. Because I like physical sports. In basketball, you got technical fouls, all that other stuff. In football, you just hit 'em. Like, if you get mad, and the next day, you got a football game, and you still mad. Go out there and take the anger out on the field.

Q:

So it helps you distress a little bit also? How long have you been playing?

EDWARDS:

Actually I just started playing, like actual tackle football last year.

Q:

How do you want others to see you, or what do you want them to see?

EDWARDS:

Like what do I want them to see in me? Potential.

Q:

You said, "potential?"

EDWARDS:

I want people to see potential.

Q:

Tell me a little bit more about that.

EDWARDS:

Like, as I said earlier, I was in Appleton, Wisconsin. I was going to this school. And at the time,

I was horrible. When I say horrible, I mean, I was bad at school. I used to jump on tables, throw chairs, all that other stuff. And as I got older, I've got better, and better, and better. Got me here today.

Q:

Do you want to talk a little bit more about that, about when you said you were horrible in school? Why do you think that was? Or in a word--

EDWARDS:

I don't know. I think it was just me, just doing stuff to be doing it.

Q:

How did you feel at the time?

EDWARDS:

I don't know. I can't say, because that all is past. That's all past tense.

Q:

Why would this project be meaningful to you?

EDWARDS:

Cause one, I just like the program, period, one. If it weren't for Ms. Mabon, I wouldn't be in this program right now. If it wasn't for her, I wouldn't be sitting right here doing this interview. If it wasn't for her, I wouldn't have even thought of this program. But now that I'm here I thank her for that. 'Cause I'm actually getting to like art, kind of like art some more. Usually, I just want to play basketball all the time. Go to the gym, play basketball. But now that I'm experiencing art and stuff, I actually want to do like art, art.

Q:

So are you discovering different parts of yourself? What do you think about that? How does that feel?

EDWARDS:

It's fun. Just a world where I can come, and I ain't being judged, being called out by name, and stuff like that-- even though that type of stuff don't hurt me-- but still. It's just getting away from all the negative energy. Getting away from all that negative stuff.

Q:

I like that. Tell me a little more about your relationship with Ms. Mabon.

EDWARDS:

Last year I really didn't know Ms. Mabon like that until this year. I knew her, but I didn't really know her like that, because me and Ms. Mabon, we're really kind of close. Like she's one of my favorite teachers in the building, besides my actual teacher.

Q:

And how did that-- how did you start getting close to her and stuff like that?

EDWARDS:

Ever since last year. Because she used to get me out of a lot of trouble. Like, last year I was on the verge of getting expelled from here. She got me off that and a whole bunch of other

stuff.

Q:

It sounds like she's really helped you in your school experience. What were some of the stories you heard from family or other people about the past that helped you understand a little bit more about yourself and what you wanted to do when you get older?

EDWARDS:

Most people, well, most kids nowadays are saying, I want to go to the NBA. I want to go to the NFL. How do we decide who it is? I won't do it unless I want to. You'll never hear about I want to be a doctor. I want to be a scientist, a biologist, all that other stuff. Nowadays, it's just about basketball and football. Like, if you want to do that, you gotta do good in school. It's not about training. You got to actually do your work, pass all your grades. You got to go to school to play basketball.

Q:

What do people need now to make their lives better?

EDWARDS:

Um, I don't know. Like, nowadays people is addicted to drugs, all this other stuff, foolishness.

Like all these homeless people out here that's asking for money, if you're smart, you know your name, and how to spell it and stuff, you can go get a job. You could go get a job yourself.

Q:

What else about Milwaukee can you tell people or experiences that you've had growing up?

EDWARDS:

Um, you hear Milwaukee, you could go spend a night in the ghetto and hear 25 gun shots.

Ain't no telling what you might hear. It might be peaceful one night, then next week it's just chaos. If you want to come here to Milwaukee-- don't get me wrong, stuff happens everywhere. Stuff even happened up in the suburbs. We're not in the suburbs. People, kids is getting kidnapped. They finding bodies. They doing a whole bunch of other stuff.

Q:

What are some of the positive things that you've experienced in the city?

EDWARDS:

All these, like, people that's donating stuff, like donating stuff to the Goodwill, Salvation Army, doing stuff positive. Like if you got negative energy, don't come around me.

Q:

I feel you on that. What are some of the obstacles that you have faced in school or just being in this area?

EDWARDS:

Um, stuff that helped me is [YAWNS]

maybe just a couple of months ago, before the beginning of the school year, they said I was reading at a third grade level. My test scores were from what, 200 all the way to 500. I learned don't just be skipping through the test. Don't skip through it. Actually read the question, and then. Because if you take your time right now at this minute, it ain't hard at all, if you actually read through it. It just takes time and patience.

Q:

What are some of the things that kind of helped you realize that?

EDWARDS:

My grades.

Q:

Tell me a little bit more about that.

EDWARDS:

I was getting bad grades. Like, one time I had all Ds, and one B, and an A or so. And now I'm trying to get all As, As and Bs. I don't want to get no Cs or Ds-- most definitely not no F.

Q:

What's motivating you to do that?

EDWARDS:

My grandma most definitely. My grandma.

Q:

Why is that?

EDWARDS:

Because my grandma, she came all the way down here from Atlanta, Georgia. She had came down here for-- I forgot what she came. No, she came down for Christmas. And she had come up to my school. I was telling her when I was on that third grade reading level, like, I was doing bad. And my grandma she was just encouraging me to do better on my tests. Don't be skipping through it. Just take your time. And that's what I'm doing now. Every time I take a test, I'm going up [SNAPS] Like that. I keep going up. Like the last two tests I took, the recent one I just took, I will went up, what, 120. And then, the one before that, I went up 200.

Q:

That's impressive. What do you-- what are some other things that you'd like to share?

EDWARDS:

Don't let people knock you off your ground. Don't let people push you around, knock you off your ground. Don't let people bully you. Stick up for yourself. Most definitely, because I don't like bullies. Like, if I see a bully right now at this minute, I'm fixing to go help that person that's getting bullied. I don't like seeing people get bullied. People with disorders, I hate seeing

people like that get picked on.

Q:

I can tell you have a very big heart. I'm trying to think. What are some other ways that you would help people if you were able to?

EDWARDS:

Give back to the homeless, like people that's actually trying to do something with their life. But their family just don't want to mess with them, like people that's actually trying. Instead of being out there begging, you could be trying to get yourself in a shelter until you could afford you a house, until you can afford to pay bills.

I don't care if you've got to work at McDonald's and still sleep on the streets. You still got money to where you can pay for what you need.

Q:

What would that mean to you if you were able to help people?

EDWARDS:

A lot. Like, every time I see a homeless person, I get them something, because they need it more than I do. Once I seen this homeless man, and he was absolutely like trying to do something with himself. I seen that. He was actually working. And he had on him some regular old shoes, and he had him a coat and that other stuff. He was standing on the island. And that was the day before my birthday. And I had a granola bar. And I knew I wasn't going to eat it, so I just gave it to him.

Q:

That's very considerate. Not a lot of people have that in them. What are some other memorable childhood experiences that kind of stick out to you and you feel have contributed to who you are now?

EDWARDS:

My house getting shot up. Yeah, when I was younger, my house had got shot up. I guess people that was living there before us, I guess something happened before to somebody or something. And, I guess, the people that shot my house up thought they still lived there.

Except when they shot my house up, I almost got hit by a bullet. If I wouldn't have dropped to the floor into my grandma's room, I would've got hit in the back of the neck.

Q:

How old were you?

EDWARDS:

I believe I was 10 or 11. It was between 9, 10, and 11.

Q:

What are some of the thoughts or feelings that you heard as these things happened?

EDWARDS:

Sometimes I was like, why me though? Why this had to happen to me and my family?

Q:

You know I was actually-- I was shot twice in my leg in a drive-in. My house got shot at when I was 13-years-old. So I know the feeling of having been in that situation.

EDWARDS:

Like shot in your kneecap?

Q:

No, I got shot through my thigh, and my calf, and my shin. Yeah, went in and out both times.

So what else do you remember? Do you want to talk a little bit more about that? After it happened--

EDWARDS:

It was below [INAUDIBLE]. My mom she said didn't want to be on that same block after seven o'clock at night.

Q:

So you couldn't go outside and be on the street or anything like that?

EDWARDS:

No, I can. She's talking about on that specific block. She didn't want to go over there. For like a week, but after seven o'clock.

Q:

What did y'all do after that happened?

EDWARDS:

We left first thing in the morning.

Q:

You moved out or--

EDWARDS:

No, we didn't actually move out. But we left for a couple of days. Because you know how some houses got that big old glass in front of their house, that's how ours was. Like this right here, it was like that big, like both of those put together. It was like that. We had a big, old window in the middle, and there's a couple bullets through there.

And then some more had hit the wall. And it hit my grandma's shelf. And I was below my grandma's shelf.

Q:

Is there-- before we close out-- any other thoughts, sentiments you want to share?

EDWARDS:

Um, no, not really. Like growing up, I had everything I really wanted. I didn't really have a rough life growing up.

Q:

I'm glad to hear that, you know. But at the same time, you know, even if you didn't, you still have a mind, you still have a heart. We just want to see if you have any thing to share with the world, you know. It doesn't necessarily have to be a negative thing. We just want you on

record. Do you have any-- What are some of the things that you would like to accomplish when you get older?

EDWARDS:

I want to make a million dollars.

Q:

What would you do with that money?

EDWARDS:

The first million dollars I make, if I make it, I'm going to give my mama, my sisters, and my siblings some state they want to go to.

Q:

It seems like your family is very important to you. What else would you do?

EDWARDS:

I guess, I would go buy my mama a car. By the time I'm grown, my sister's going to be 16. I'll get her a car and my dad a car.

Q:

What about you?

EDWARDS:

I'm gonna hit myself, too.

Q:

What kind would you get?

EDWARDS:

My dream car, I want to get a-- dang, what's that car called? I forgot what it's called, a Venom.

Q:

A Venom? What is that, a--

EDWARDS:

It's like a real fast car. I think it's like the fastest car in the world or something like that.

Q:

Wow. That's dope. OK, that about wraps it up.

Today's day is Monday, March 4. This is Sergio Muniz interviewing

SPENCER:

Keshawn. Keshawn Spencer.

Q:

Keshawn Spencer, do I have your permission to record this interview for the 2019 portrait project?

SPENCER:

Yes.

Q:

Make sure you try to speak in a clear voice so we get it all recorded. All right, so thinking back on your early life, tell me about the most memorable childhood experience you can recall.

SPENCER:

Moving to a new school, because I thought I was going to get treated different. Because at my

old school, I used to get all the attention. But here-- well, I thought when I moved here, it was going to be like, people wouldn't accept me for who I am.

Q:

Tell me a little bit more about that.

SPENCER:

Oh, when I actually got here and met my new friends, I actually was like, I'm glad that I came here. I don't know what I would be doing if I was at my old school.

Q:

What does that mean to you?

SPENCER:

I'm just glad I came here. 'Cause like, at my old school, it wasn't even all that good. This school, I'm not saying it's perfect, but it's perfect for me. And I like it.

Q:

Why do you say that?

SPENCER:

Because like, the teachers, they weren't like my old teachers. My old teachers, they were like-it was just something. It was something weird about them to where like, if they would be teaching something, and they'll explain one thing. And then like, when they teach you to the way they explained it, and then later on, when you understand the first way, they'll put it in a different way to make you get confused.

Q:

So thinking about that, what were also some of the obstacles that you faced?

SPENCER:

People and my voice when they first heard my voice. I was like, oh, no. So on the first day, I only talked when I had to ask the teacher questions. When people ask me, I'd just like, not like sign language, but I would like shake my head, no, yes. Shrug my shoulders no or I don't know. I thought they was gonna like-- I knew how their reaction was going to be. They'd just look at me. Like is this dude OK? He needs some water.

[LAUGHS]

Q:

Did you ever feel any type of way about that?

SPENCER:

Nah, because at my old school, that happened all the time. All the time.

Q:

So you kind of got used to it?

SPENCER:

Yeah.

Q:

What other childhood experiences can you tell me about?

SPENCER:

Growing up without a dad. 'Cause my dad, he was just in and out of jail and stuff. So I really didn't get to see him. Well, actually my dad, he's in my life now. But like, when I grew up, I thought I just-- I don't know. It was weird. I knew everybody had a dad. But I thought I was only one who didn't have a dad. When it came to Father's Day and stuff, I ain't had no father, like, you know, write letters to and give gifts. But, yeah.

Q:

What did you feel?

SPENCER:

I felt like-- I felt like I was different than others. Because everybody, well, almost everybody I knew, they had a dad. But I just felt left out. I was only left out, because like if there was a special moment, and the sons would go somewhere with they dad, I wouldn't have a dad to go there with.

Q:

What other effects do you think that it had on you?

SPENCER:

No, so I grew up around my Granny, my mom, and like, my-- Yeah, basically just Granny and my mom. And like, our immediate, like a dude, like a male, there to tell me the male ways.

Because I knew about like-- Like makeup and stuff, that's what I was mostly around. Because females like makeup and doing their hair and stuff. But I didn't want that. I wanted to be able to do manly stuff.

'Cause when I get older, I don't want to be out there talking about makeup, and hair, and stuff.

I wanted to be talking about things that men talk about, like working out, being buff, you know, doing what they do. Gotta do it for they woman and stuff. That's what I always thought a man would talk about.

Q:

OK. But what did that mean for you to be able to do that?

SPENCER:

It would mean that-- well, to me it would mean that I'm becoming more older, and mature, and stuff. 'Cause like, as you young, you just talking about like-- I don't know. It's weird. Because when you're young, you talking about you've got a girlfriend and stuff. It ain't just how it is when you're older. Because when you're older, when you have a girlfriend, you actually know the responsibilities that it take to be in a relationship. But When you young, it's different because you don't know what you're doing. You just want to go out with her because you just want to.

Q:

So it would have helped to have some sort of guide to kind of show you the ways.

SPENCER:

My uncle helped me a lot and just experiences in the world, watching TV shows, and everything. That's what helped me get through it.

Q:

Oh, yeah? Tell me a little bit more about the relationship with your uncle.

SPENCER:

Oh, my uncle, he's always telling me stories, about like, he gets all the ladies and stuff He thinks he gets all the ladies. So, I mean, he just said-- like basically, growing up, he was telling me what I have to do to have a girl like notice me, and like me, and stuff, and what I can't do-that women are not interested in and what they don't like.

Q:

Tell me something else about your life. Where were you born, or another childhood experience?

SPENCER:

Well, I was born actually in St. Joe's over there.

Q:

Here in Milwaukee.

SPENCER:

Yeah.

Q:

OK.

SPENCER:

So I remember when I was growing up, I had a scar on my side. I remember a little bit of it. I remember me crying and having my reaction. I was trying to ride downstairs on my bike. I don't know how, but the bike, something happened, and it tilted over. At the time, my bike, it wasn't all that. Them little bars, them soft things on it, they was gone. It was just the metal, and the metal poked me. And it almost went through my skin. Oh, I think it did.

Q:

Yeah. What else happened?

SPENCER:

Oh, my mom, she was asking me, did I need to go to the hospital and stuff. And I was like no, because I was scared. And I didn't want to get no stitches.

Q:

That's funny.

SPENCER:

Oh, yeah, another thing is with me getting injured, because I'm clumsy. I was at school with this boy. He had games at the time. He had like PS3s and stuff. He had games for sale or for free. Everybody started running towards him. It was packed in the hallway. And I was running.

This teacher opened the door, and the edge of the door hit me right in the middle of my head.

Actually it left a scar. She said-- I started bleeding. I didn't know at first, until somebody said, Keshawn, you're bleeding. And I didn't know. I wasn't crying or nothing. I was worried about them games.

[LAUGHS] I wanted them.

Q:

Which game was it?

SPENCER:

Well, I don't know. He just said games. And I just dashed. I was gone. And that was my first time getting stitches.

Q:

OK, so tell me a little bit about who have been the most important people in your life.

SPENCER:

Um.

Q:

Like family, friends, teachers, community.

SPENCER:

All right, when it comes to family, it's hard because it's like-- it's obvious. It's my mother and my grandma. But my brother, he ain't been there my whole life. But he's still important, of course.

My mother and my granny-- my mother because that's the lady that birthed me. And she buys my clothes and shoes. And she love me, and I love my mom, too. And my granny, my granny always told me the right thing and the wrong thing. No, she always told me to do the right thing and not to do the wrong thing.

Because she told me the consequences if I do the wrong thing and the outcome if I do the right thing. And now, I ain't gonna say I'm perfect. Because I do bad stuff sometimes. But like, when it comes to me doing good stuff, I think of mama and granny. If I get a reward for doing some good, I think about my grandma all the time. Because you have to treat a lady that has, you know. Or my mom, too, because when it comes to being good with my mom, all I think about is that belt. It's just over because that belt coming.

Q:

So then how would how would they describe you? How do they describe you?

SPENCER:

My mom describe me as like, playing a game a lot, black, a lot of things. She can say, like-my mom, I'm not saying that I'm one thing, but my nickname is weird. So it's-- Is that paused?

Q:

No.

SPENCER:

Oh, but like, I don't know. My nickname was weird. And when she had said it in public, I would be so embarrassed. My friend, Steve, he's my closest friend. I've been with him since I was like seven years old, maybe even younger. We grew up on the same block. We had never-well, he actually lived away from me. He always lived away at his grandma's house. So his mom knew he was close. He always wanted to be at his grandma's house. Because he wanted to be outside with me. Because by his own house, he had no friends. So his mom decided to move over by us. Because his grandma lives on the block. Me, him, I got some other cousins that live on my block. It's just like a family block basically.

Q:

That's pretty cool.

SPENCER:

Yeah, he's my closest friend. And I consider him as my cousin or my best friend. Yeah.

Community-wise, the closest person to me-- nobody really, as community-wise.

Q:

Yeah, that's fine, too. So then how would these people that you believe are important, how would they describe you as a person?

SPENCER:

Oh, my granny would describe me as smart. My mom, she would describe me probably as somebody that ain't gonna give up. My best friend, Steve, he would describe me as a jokester.

Like he would say I play too much and stuff. Because with my friends, I don't take stuff serious, unless it has to be serious. Like with my friends I just play around a lot.

Q:

You like to have fun.

SPENCER:

We don't get real deep about stuff.

Q:

Yeah, you like to have fun.

SPENCER:

Yeah, have fun. I think like getting real deep has to stay with like, parents.

Q:

That's just part of being a kid, right. How do you think people perceive you? How do you think people see you?

SPENCER:

Um, people see me as-- well, besides my voice, they see me as-- I really don't know. I would think they see me as like-- well, my friend told me once when I first came, he said I look like I get anything I want, and I'm spoiled and stuff. So that's how I always think. When I see somebody looking at me, I just think they thinking I'm spoiled, or I get what I want. But if you

was at my house, you would know that I don't.

[LAUGHS] Grades come first.

Q:

Grades come first, you said?

SPENCER:

Yeah.

Q:

That's important. How do you feel about people maybe thinking about you?

SPENCER:

I think that everybody got they thoughts and ideas, so you can't judge nobody for what they think. Because they can't-- Well, they can help it, but at the same time, they really can't help it.

Q:

So it doesn't really bother you?

SPENCER:

Nah.

Q:

Or anything like that? So then how do you think that people perceive youth of color in Milwaukee? Or how do people perceive your neighborhood?

SPENCER:

You talking like how they treat it?

Q:

How do they see youth of color, and how-- how do they see your neighborhood?

SPENCER:

Oh. Like--

Q:

Like what do people think about, when you think about--

SPENCER:

Like when somebody walks by my neighborhood, what do they think about it?

Q:

Yeah, that, or, just in general, you as a young black man. What do you think Milwaukee or the world sees about youth of color?

SPENCER:

Well, if somebody waned to walk past my block, I would think they would be like, I wonder who taking care of these houses. Because on my block, the grass is not all that good. But there's this one lady. I'm not going to say her name. But she keep her grass-- Like, her yard, she plants flowers. She grows tomatoes and stuff. Her grass is always nice. She lawnmower it. She shovel it. She water it. And everybody is just having a competition and stuff, like, to see who has the best house or the best-looking yard. But I think people see my block as dirty. People

won't take care of it. That's how they'll see the block.

Q:

So then you think you think people might see it that way, but you're say that there's other good things.

SPENCER:

Yeah, to me, how I see my own block, I see it as just home, where I live. Because I don't go too far from my-- well, the farthest I've been was probably a mile. Yeah.

Q:

That's not too far. That like a bike ride, right?

SPENCER:

Yeah, a mile as in walking.

Q:

Do you want to tell me a little bit more about that, about your neighborhood, and the things you see positive, negative?

SPENCER:

Positive, I see people, you know, with their kids playing outside. I don't know if you know the game, it's like cans, where you shoot the ball at a can. That's my favorite game when it's summer. I like basketball, too. The negative is like, the adults acting like they kids, arguing all the time. You just look at them like, how old are you?

Q:

Right.

[LAUGHS] That's interesting. So I'm thinking a little bit still about Milwaukee, right. How do you think the world sees you and your friends, like, young black men?

SPENCER:

Well, coming to racism, if me and my friends want to be walking down the street, and somebody will see us through the window, they'll be looking like, they be up to no good. That's the first thing that will come to their head. And I guarantee that. We don't even be-- we just be walking just for fun. Somebody will look out the window and they'll be like, oh, they up to no good. I remember this man. He called the police on us one time. 'Cause we was-- We was running through the alley. We was running. We was having a race, and he thought we was doing something else. I don't what he thought we was doing, but he called the police on us.

Q:

And then what happened?

SPENCER:

The police didn't even go. So he was feeling kind of salty.

Q:

Wow. And how do you feel about that, that people--

SPENCER:

I feel that he should actually know something before he try to react to it. If he didn't think-- key word, you can't think about-- you can't think you know what this person is doing. You got to know for sure. Like, confirming.

Q:

Yeah, that could be trouble on both sides for everybody involved. So then what do you think are some of the obstacles that you have in front of you as young, black man?

SPENCER:

Obstacles growing up? I don't know, like, high school is what I'm really worried about. Because my mom is telling me like this school is not really teaching us nothing. They're not really trying to prepare us. So, well-- when I see school as you come, you do your work. You'll get your grade, but at the same time, it's like you're playing around a lot, talking a lot. But in high school, the way my mom is putting it, it just makes me want to focus even harder. I'm planning on getting into to Riverside.

Q:

Riverside? That's a good school. That's a really good school. You know our director for our program? Do you remember Danel? He went to Riverside.

SPENCER:

I heard that you and my step-dad went to Tech together.

Q:

Yeah. What's his name?

SPENCER:

Dre.

Q:

Dre, yeah, we did. He was here, right, the other day? Yeah we did.

[LAUGHS] That's funny. So then, what has stood out to you about yourself throughout your life? How would you describe yourself? What makes you, you?

SPENCER:

What makes me me is just doing what I want or what I feel like doing. Because somebody will tell me, oh, I shouldn't do this or that. But if I really want to do it, I'm gonna just do it. Because that's who I am. I consider myself as a daredevil. Because I'll do anything. If somebody were to tell me to jump-- on my block, we'll climb the gate to get to the garage. But it will be so hard, but I'll be the only one that'll be able to get up there. Because they will be scared to get hurt by the fence. I wouldn't care though.

Q:

So you like to take chances?

SPENCER:

And I remember, it was a squirrel. He was by me. I was being a weirdo, just trying to mess with it. I didn't care because they was like, he's gonna scratch you. And I heard that like, they were gonna scratch your eyeballs out. At the time, I was like, I don't care. I'm gonna still mess with it.

Q:

And what happened? Did you catch it?

SPENCER:

It ran.

[LAUGHS] And I fell. Because I was trying to reach for it, and I fell.

Q:

That's funny. So thinking about that, what are your dreams for the future?

SPENCER:

Well, if it was a dream that I could have come true, basketball. But when it comes to dreams for your future, I know not everybody making it to the NBA. So, like, I will be a drummer, a professional drummer, an investigator, a plumber. Because I like working on stuff. I love drumming. I like making beats and stuff, rapping. I like a lot of thins. But I got to do something I know I can for sure, for sure, probably have a better chance of getting into it. Because like a rapper, not everybody makes it. A basketball player not everybody definitely don't make it.

Because isn't it hard being a rapper? Well, it is, but it's not. It's hard trying to come up. But when you up there, it's easy. All you to do is just-- like basically, you just get paid to rap on beats basically. That's all you do.

Q:

That sounds like a fun job. So then, if it's not the NBA, what are your backup plans?

SPENCER:

Investigator. Me and my friend plan on being, both working for the same FBI company. And it's gonna be fun. Because we're weirdos. It's like-- when somebody gets shot on the street, and their body laying down, we like looking at it and investigating that stuff. A lot of people are scared of it. But me, I'm not scared of it.

Q:

You find it interesting.

SPENCER:

Yeah, I find it interesting.

Q:

What are some of the things that you think made you interested in that?

SPENCER:

Funerals. Just seeing people's dead bodies, it wasn't weird to me. They just be like them. Like

when I see somebody dead, I don't think of them differently. I just think of them as how I always thought of them. So I want to investigate them, see more about them, their life story and stuff. And it be like this dead person is or has been through and stuff. It would be more fun.

Q:

So it just kind of interests you to see or wondering, putting the pieces together, putting the story together.

SPENCER:

Yeah, and also to put in with that, I like finding people. I like that. Like if that person has killed them, and they're on the run or whatever, and we have to find them. I like finding clues, getting me closer to finding that person, like fingerprints and stuff.

Q:

That's pretty interesting stuff. Do you watch any shows or anything?

SPENCER:

I watch Criminal Minds.

Q:

That's a good one.

SPENCER:

I watch-- I don't know what it's called. I think it's called First 48 or something like that. I watch that. And I like watching Police.

Q:

The cop shows and stuff?

SPENCER:

Yeah, like they just pull people over, arrest them and stuff.

Q:

Just trying to see what's going on.

SPENCER:

Yeah, I'm trying to see what's going on.

Q:

How do you want others to see you? What do you want the world to see?

SPENCER:

I want them to see me as somebody, I guess, like a goofball, got a squeaky voice. But that can actually do something with their life. Because a lot of people like-- I'm not saying they say it towards me, but I know a lot of that have told somebody that they gonna be one of the drunk uncles on the couch and stuff, sleeping on the couch. And I just think they shouldn't be thinking that because it may backfire.

Q:

What does that mean to you?

SPENCER:

Um, they just shouldn't be doing that. Because it ain't cool. Because if it was on them, they'd

be looking stupid.

Q:

Tell me more about when you said that you wish people could see you as somebody that could actually do something.

SPENCER:

Now I think people see me as like a goofball, like I said. I don't want them to see me as that.

Because they may think-- I'm not saying people are have said it. But they may think of me as one of the drunk uncles on the couch, you know, just doing stuff they have no business doing.

But then it will be different if they actually see me, and I'm doing something with my life.

Because they may be the ones asking me for money or for help-- or for my help, I mean.

Q:

Yeah, you have a point. So does portrait reflect you, the pictures that we took? What are you doing in the portrait, do you remember?

SPENCER:

Yeah, the pictures, the photo shoot or whatever. For the photo shoot, I think it was one or two pictures that reflected me. The other one was just me being like a style or whatever. But I think the Bulls, like, when I was doing the Michael Jordan sign, because I like basketball. And I think there was another one. I was bending down. I wasn't on my knees, but I was bending down like I was an investigator.

Q:

Like you were looking for a clue on the ground or something?

SPENCER:

Yeah.