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M O D E R N

M A S T E R S

V O L U M E

F O U R T E E N :

FRANK CHO

By Eric Nolen-Weathington

M O D E R N M A S T E R S V O L U M E F O U RT E E N :

FRANK CHO edited and designed by Eric Nolen-Weathington front cover art by Frank Cho front cover color by Brandon Peterson all interviews in this book were conducted by Eric Nolen-Weathington and transcribed by Steven Tice

TwoMorrows Publishing 10407 Bedfordtown Dr. Raleigh, North Carolina 27614 www.twomorrows.com • e-mail: twomorrow@aol.com First Printing • November 2007 • Printed in Canada Softcover ISBN: 978-1-893905-84-9 Trademarks & Copyrights All characters and artwork contained herein are ™ and ©2007 Frank Cho unless otherwise noted. Liberty Meadows, University2 and all related characters ™ and ©2007 Frank Cho. Zombie King ™ and ©2007 Frank Cho and Eric Crowe. Summer Days ™ and ©2007 Frank Cho and Scott Kurtz. Batman, Bat-Mite, Black Condor, Catman, Catwoman, Doll Man, The Freedom Fighters, The Human Bomb, Mr. Mxyzptlk, Phantom Lady, The Ray, Selina Kyle, Superman, Uncle Sam ™ and ©2007 DC Comics. Greyshirt, Tesla Strong and all related characters ™ and ©2007 America’s Best Comics, LLC. Ares, Avengers, Black Cat, Black Widow, Brood Queen, Captain America, Dr. Octopus, Elektra, Hank Pym, Iron Man, Lindy Reynolds, Madame Hydra, Magneto, Mary Parker, Mary Jane Parker, May Parker, Mr. Fantastic, Nick Fury, Peter Parker, Sentinels, Sentry, Shanna the She-Devil, Spider-Man, Spider-Woman, Storm, Tigra, Ultron, Venom, Wasp, Wolverine, Wonder Man ™ and ©2007 Marvel Characters, Inc. Cavewoman ™ and ©2007 Budd Root. Nodwick ™ and ©2007 Aaron Williams. Atom Eve, Invincible ™ and ©2007 Robert Kirkman and Cory Walker. Jade Fontaine, PvP, Scratch, Skull the Troll ™ and ©2007 Scott Kurtz. Caspar the Friendly Ghost ™ and ©2007 Harvey Entertainment, Inc. Witchblade ™ and ©2007 Top Cow Productions. Secret Agent X-9 ™ and ©2007 King Features Syndicate, Inc. Barsoom, Dejah Thoris, Jane, Tarzan ™ and ©2007 ERB, Inc. Conan ™ and ©2007 Conan Properties International, LLC. King Kong ™ and ©2007 Universal Studios, Inc. Editorial package ©2007 Eric Nolen-Weathington and TwoMorrows Publishing.

Dedication To “my Brandy,” Donna, the love of my life. And to Iain and Caper, the adorable goofballs of my life. Acknowledgements Frank Cho, for all his time and effort, and for all his suggestions regarding future Modern Masters candidates. Special Thanks Dave Colombo, Ray Cuthbert, Bill Maio, Benno Rothschild, Tom Ziuko, Rick McGee and the crew of Foundation’s Edge, Russ Garwood and the crew of Capital Comics, and John and Pam Morrow

Modern Masters Volume Fourteen:

FRANK CHO

Table of Contents Introduction by Brandon Peterson . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 Part One: Tales of a Fifth Grade Comic Book Artist. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 Interlude: Under the Influence . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 17 Part Two: Taking Shelter in Liberty Meadows . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 21 Part Three: You Never Forget Your First Love . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 44 Part Four: Storytelling and the Creative Process . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 69 Art Gallery . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 85

Part 1:

Tales of a Fifth Grade Comic Book Artist

MODERN MASTERS: Do you remember anything about your childhood in Korea? You moved when you were about six years old, right?

school, so you had to get used to a new kind of school system, new people, not to mention the language barrier. Did you have any problems making the transition?

FRANK CHO: Right. I was born near Seoul, South Korea. When I was six, we immigrated to the United States.

FRANK: It was pretty tough. I remember I had to go to “English As a Second Language” class, up until fourth grade, I believe. That was pretty tough.... It was comic books that helped me learn the English language, because of the pictures and words.

MM: Do you remember anything about Korea? FRANK: A little bit. I remember kindergarten. I remember just little stuff, nothing concrete.

MM: So when did you start becoming interested in art? FRANK: Pretty much, as far back as I can remember. My dad is artistic. I inherited my artistic talent from him. I started drawing at an early age and didn’t stop. As I got older, it just increased in intensity. I guess my first real awareness of my passion for art, oddly, came right around the time we left for the United States; it was around the same time Norman Rockwell died, and his art was all over the place. I remember seeing some of his paintings and I was just amazed that those were paintings and not photographs, and feelings it invoked from a single image. So I think that was my first real awareness of art, of the power of art. And from then on, it just snowballed.

MM: Have you ever had any kind of interest in going back and exploring your heritage? FRANK: Not really. My parents get on my case about it, but I’ve been in this country for almost 30 years now, and I still haven’t seen a lot of the major landmarks. So I’d like to explore the United States before I go to Korea. I still haven’t gone to Disneyworld or the Grand Canyon—the big stuff. MM: So what was Beltsville, Maryland like for you as a sixyear-old moving from Korea?

MM: Did it take you a while to make friends, since you weren’t able to communicate as well? Plus it appears you moved around a bit early on. Do you think that added to your interest in art, because it’s such an isolated pastime?

FRANK: Actually, we first moved in with my mother’s sister, my aunt and her husband, in Philly. We lived there for a few months, and then we moved to Prince George’s County in Maryland—Landover, Maryland. It’s right next to Largo, Maryland. And from there we moved to Beltsville.

FRANK: No. I’m a pretty social and friendly guy. I didn’t have any trouble making friends. I drew a lot. Language wasn’t really too much of a barrier. Many of the kids I grew up with were very patient and friendly, and helped me overcome the language barrier. I was extremely lucky to have friends who were very patient with me.

MM: Did you have any trouble integrating? I mean, you’d already started 6

MM: You said your father was artistic. Did he draw much while you were growing up? Did he tell you, “This is the brush that you use,” and that kind of thing? FRANK: Not really. My dad had taken many art classes in his youth and was a standout art student, but he never became a professional artist. MM: It was more of a hobby for him? FRANK: Well, even as a hobby, he didn’t really draw much. My first memory of my father doing something artistic was right before we left for the United States. I guess he got suckered into building a model boat for one of his friends or co-workers. It was this historic Korean warship that was shaped like a turtle with a dragon’s head at the bow. I remember him carving this boat from a block of wood. It was about two feet long. It was pretty impressive. I’m pretty sure that, looking at it with adult eyes, it wasn’t as intricate as my childhood memory remembers it being, but as a child, I remember just being blown away by it. I remember my dad shaping the pencils into miniature cannons and carving the powerful and fearsome dragon’s head— all the little details that he put in. My dad was a great artist.... When we came to the United States, we were pretty poor. We didn’t know anyone. No money or free time. We didn’t really do any traveling. My dad had two jobs. He was a janitor at night for Greyhound, and he was a carpenter during the day, and my mom worked at a shoe factory. So the only times that I saw my dad using his artistic ability was when I had a science fair or science project to do and he would help me. I would screw up, and my dad would help me build or fix something. I remember a couple of times he actually drew the poster that I was supposed to hand in, and I was just amazed at the posters that he drew. It was pretty impressive. MM: You said you used comics to help you learn English. What were the comics you were reading as a kid when you first started reading them? FRANK: I remember my dad bringing comics home from his work when he worked as the janitor at the Greyhound station. He would bring home these old comics that people just left at the station. But it wasn’t until fifth grade that I became really interested in comics, because all my friends started collecting comics at the time. So it was about ’83 that I really started collecting comics, when I really became aware of comics. My friends and I only collected Marvel titles: Fantastic Four, Uncanny X-Men, Spider-Man. I think Walt Simonson’s Thor started up around 7

FRANK: I based lot of the animal characters on my friends’ personalities. Dean the Pig is based on my old college dorm mate, Dean Markos. I didn’t even changed the name. The real Dean—Dean Markos— is half Greek and half Italian. He was quite a character—one of the funniest guys I’ve met, and a really nice guy. And he was a pretty heavy smoker, even though he was studying to be a pharmacist. The other animal characters, Ralph and Leslie, they’re just kind of a hodgepodge of my friends and people I’ve known. So, to a certain extent, I really wasn’t making too much stuff up. I was just using stuff that happened to me, or stories or jokes that my friends would tell each other, as a launching pad for a longer joke or storyline. Above: Convention sketch of Dean the Pig. Below: The guys of Tri Kuppa Brew after a rough night.

MM: As you were preparing your submission package for Liberty Meadows, obviously you’ve got to make something that’s going to appeal to a national audience, as best you can and still be true to yourself. How did you make that decision as to what to use or what to change and that kind of thing? FRANK: [laughs] My stuff is pretty much rated PG-13 and R, around that area. So I took all the strips that were more PG and put them all together. It was more like the highlights of University2. And I just changed the premise for mass appeal, because University2 is a raunchy college

strip about bunch of live lab animals who escape to the University of Maryland, and then they get recruited into one of the local fraternities, the Tri Kuppa Brew. That’s the setup. For Liberty Meadows, I pretty much took all the strips and made sure there were no college references and set it up at an animal sanctuary. That explains all the crazy animals. I sent that submission packet to the top syndicates: Universal, United, King Features, Washington Post Writers Group, Tribune, Creators Syndicate, etc., and I got rejected by all of them, except for Creators Syndicate. They were the last syndicate that I heard back from. And it was pretty discouraging. A couple of the syndication submission editors actually took time to explain why they were rejecting my strip, which was really nice. Basically they were saying that my strip was too aggressive and my characters were too ugly. They said it was entertaining but the humor was just too aggressive and sexy for the family newspaper market. So I get all these rejections, then I get a call from Creators Syndicate. They said, “Did you sign with anybody yet?” I said, “No.” They said, “Don’t sign with anyone, we’re sending you a contract right away.” So within a week they sent me a contract to be a syndicated cartoonist. This all happened while I was in college, before I graduated from nursing school, so it all happened very fast. I was extremely lucky.

Interlude:

Under the Influence

Norman Rockwell I connected with Norman Rockwell’s art early on. My earliest memory of art in any form was Norman Rockwell’s paintings. Not only was he a flawless painter but he was a brilliant storyteller. Each of his paintings told a story, which is an incredible feat. He may be the greatest American illustrator of the 20th century. Norman Rockwell is still a constant source of inspiration for me.

John Buscema

You can’t be in the comic business without acknowledging John Buscema. After Jack Kirby and Neal Adams, John Buscema may be the most influential artist in American comic books. John Buscema helped me build a solid base in storytelling and figure work in my formative years. He was a superb draftsman. His drawings were like a textbook on composition, anatomy and visual storytelling. His art instruction book, How To Draw the Marvel Way, was the bible to me growing up. Jack Kirby may have built the Marvel house but it was John Buscema and John Romita Sr. who helped maintain it in the early years.

John Singer Sargent

One word comes to my mind when I think of John Singer Sargent: class. There’s a sense of elegance and grace in his art. Everyone and everything he painted looks very noble and endlessly charming. With a few economical brush strokes he could make a sunburned, pleasant milk maid look like the Queen of England.

Part 2:

Taking Shelter in Liberty Meadows Post-it notes on my art with little arrows pointing to Brandy’s breasts and butt saying “reduce breasts, reduce butt.” [laughter] So I would go back and white out Brandy’s figure and try to change her from a D cup to B cup.

MM: What kind of input did the syndicate have on the development of Liberty Meadows?

FRANK: Some, but not too much. The main thing that I changed was turning Frank the Duck, the duck boy, into a human character. Liberty Meadows was an animal sanctuary, and I wanted to make Frank into an animal doctor. The rest of the characters were the same as they were in University2, the college strip. The big change that the syndicate made me do was turning Leslie the Laughing Lima Bean into Leslie the Bullfrog, which was funny as hell. I said, “Why do you want me to change Leslie?” I thought a talking vegetable was so strange that it was funny. But they said it didn’t make sense. They said a talking vegetable doesn’t make sense, but a talking frog does.

MM: That didn’t last terribly long, though. FRANK: As time went by, I gradually made Brandy’s boobs and her butt bigger. I did it under the radar and my editors didn’t really notice it. By year five, Brandy had more curves than the beltway. MM: Were you able to use those strips that you had sent in as the first part of the continuity for the strip? At what point, from the time you signed the contract, did you actually start running in the papers? FRANK: They gave me a year. Actually, I requested a year before they launched, because, again, my dream was to be a comic book artist. Normally the syndicates only give you maybe six months lead time to stockpile your strips before the launch. But I requested a little over a year because I wanted to break into the comic book market and scratch my comic book itch. I tried out for the Dark Horse Tarzan. I was and still am a huge Edgar Rice Burroughs fan. Brandy ™ and Frank Cho. My good friend, Al Gross, wanted to break into comics, too and he had a contact at Dark Horse. So he and I joined together and submitted Burroughs related stuff to Dark Horse. Al got accepted, but Dark Horse turned me down. So I said,

MM: Well, he is on an animal sanctuary, so I guess I can see their point, to an extent. FRANK: I had a setup for Leslie. Brandy was gardening and she had some new fertilizer, and then while she was gardening, one of the vegetables started talking to her. That was my setup for Leslie, but they didn’t like that. They said, “You’ve got to turn it into a talking animal.” I go, “What’s the difference between a talking vegetable and a talking animal?” We fought over that, and I gave in. “You guys know what you’re talking about, so I’ll change it,” so I did. And then they’d keep telling me to tone Brandy down. When I sent them the first five weeks of the strip, they sent most of the strips back with little 21

Part 3:

You Never Forget Your First Love and it was about an alien that could transfer its mind and take over bodies. Kind of like Deadman. It was a light, comedy adventure written by Al Gross and Mark Wheatley. I was doing that when I was finishing up nursing school.

MM: From what I can tell, your first comics job outside of your Liberty Meadows stuff was a pin-up for Batman: No Man’s Land. Is that the first thing you remember doing, or is there something else? This is back in 1999, I think. Oh, no, actually, you did a Cavewoman story first, right?

MM: Was that an ongoing feature, or was that just a one-shot thing? I know Penthouse Comix usually had several four- or fivepage stories.

FRANK: Yeah, I handled Cavewoman stuff first. I met Bud Root in North Carolina. I think there was a small convention called Dream Con or something like that, and Bud and I were guests. We hit it off right away. This was in ’97, I think. And I started doing a bunch of pin-ups and short stories for Bud just for fun. I think my first real, professional job in comics was for DC. I think I did a Wonder Woman pin-up.

FRANK: I think it was a 12-chapter story. I did the first two chapters and was working on the third one when we got orders to stop it. And thank God it was never published. They canceled Penthouse Comix an issue or two before our debut, so the story never saw print.

MM: That was for the JSA Secret Files book.

MM: After being in that comic strip mindset for so long, did you have any problems adjusting to the format? Just in terms of pacing and that kind of thing?

FRANK: Yeah. Is that the first one? I’m not sure. MM: They came out around the same time, so it could have been either one—the Batman pin-up or the Wonder Woman pin-up.

FRANK: A little bit. It was very exciting, because I had always felt trapped in that four-panel comic strip grid, and suddenly I got these big, open pages to do whatever I wanted. So it was a little bit overwhelming, but it wasn’t too bad of a transition.

FRANK: Well, if you really want to get technical, my first professional comics job was for Penthouse Comix. That was around 1995, I think. It was called “The Body,” 44

MM: Did you pencil and ink that story? FRANK: Yeah, I penciled and inked it, and Mark Wheatley colored it MM: Did Penthouse pay you? FRANK: Penthouse paid Mark, and Mark paid me. Mark got the lion’s share since he created it. MM: Gotcha. They paid quite a bit more than the average comic company. FRANK: Yeah, I think they easily paid double the average comic rate at that time. Maybe triple the rate, something like that. MM: So you were kind of spoiled right off the bat. FRANK: Yeah, being a college kid, it was pretty exciting. I wasn’t rich, but I did okay for a college kid. MM: After you those first two DC pinups, you started doing covers and pin-ups for a lot of different people. Were you just doing them for people you knew, or for anybody who asked? You did something for Wolff & Byrd, Jingle Belle, and things like that. FRANK: Well, pretty much anyone who asked. And half the jobs I didn’t charge for because I knew the people well and considered them my friends. Like Bud Root, I didn’t charge him for any of the covers or pin-ups. Wolff & Byrd, the same deal. Yeah, DC was pretty good about it. They paid me promptly. However, I was surprised that DC never hired me for a story. MM: You did the three pages of World’s Funnest. FRANK: That was through Evan Dorkin. Evan Dorkin personally invited me. I honestly don’t think DC knew who I was. And it was only after Marvel put me under an exclusive contract that DC actually showed any interest, aside from the couple of pin-ups and covers that I did prior to Marvel. And I got those DC jobs from people who knew me. Usually it was the writers who personally asked for me—I don’t think DC editors really knew who I was.

MM: How was that World’s Funnest job? I mean, you only did three pages, but it looked pretty fun. And you got to draw Phantom Lady. I’m sure that’s why Evan thought of you. FRANK: Yeah, Evan said, “You’re going to love Phantom Lady.” MM: Did you know who the Freedom Fighters were at that time? FRANK: Yeah, I knew. I did a lot of reading when I was a kid, so I knew all the characters. But it’s just one of those things that you never thought of drawing: the 45

FRANK: Two characters that I really enjoy drawing, which surprised me... I mean, Ms. Marvel is a given. But Ares has really grown on me. MM: I thought that would be your answer just from the way you draw him. It looks like you’re really enjoying going to town with him. Right: Model sheet for Ares. Below: Ares shows his rough edge right away, as Iron Man and Ms. Marvel recruit him for the team. Next Page: Venom preliminary sketch. Ares, Iron Man, Ms. Marvel, Venom ™ and ©2007 Marvel Characters, Inc.

FRANK: Yeah, Brian wrote Ares as a total jerk. Like Wolverine used to be. It’s just fun to draw nasty characters, because everyone is all good and professional, but Ares is such a raving jerk. You can cut loose on him, while with the other characters you kind of have to hold back. Ares is a great over-the-top character, and Brian’s handling him beautifully. MM: So how many issues are you planning on doing for Mighty Avengers? FRANK: Well, I’m only doing the first six issues. I’ve taken myself out of the rotation, because it takes me eight to ten weeks to do an issue. The monthly grind doesn’t suit me anymore. Right after the sixth issue, I’m doing the Mighty Avengers Annual #1 and then I’ll finish up Shanna MAX, and after

that, who knows? But I know that Brian wants me on Mighty Avengers as long as I’m happy. MM: Is it disappointing to you at all that you can’t keep a monthly schedule? FRANK: Hell, yeah. It’s frustrating and embarrassing that I can’t handle a monthly book like I used to. I used to pencil and ink a book in 6 weeks. I did Zombie King #0 in 4 weeks, and I wrote, drew, and lettered that. I would prefer to be a monthly artist. When I was doing Liberty Meadows, it was a daily comic strip with a daily deadline. I did that for about ten years if you include my college years, so I know I have the speed. But, for whatever reason lately, I’ve become very selfconscious about my comic book work and slowed down. To me, none of my drawings are good enough, so I draw and redraw it constantly, analyzing every line and panel. I really hate myself for dropping the ball on Mighty Avengers.

Part 4:

Storytelling and the Creative Process home. Then shortly after that I go pick up Samantha from daycare. I keep them occupied until dinner time, around 6:00. My wife comes home and we have dinner, play with the kids, put them to bed. and then I spend some time with my wife. Around 9:30 I go back to work—my second shift. This is when I really work, because the phone’s not ringing. This is when I do the bulk of my drawing—I’m a night-owl. I draw from 9:30 ’til three in the morning. Then I go to sleep and start the whole routine over again.

MM: Do you have a regular routine you try to stick to? I’m sure it isn’t exactly the same from day to day, but do you have a certain order you like to do things?

FRANK: It’s pretty much a seven-days-a-week job. It drives my wife crazy, because I really don’t get any break at all. Going to a convention is my “break,” so to speak. MM: And that’s a working vacation. FRANK: Yeah, exactly. It’s pretty non-stop. I get up around 7:30 with the kids and help them get ready for school and day care—fix their breakfast and get them dressed. I drop Emily off at the bus stop and make sure she gets on the bus. After that I drive my other daughter, Samantha, to daycare. By the time I get home, it’s around 9:00, I start my first shift of work.

MM: Do you change your tools depending on the job, or are there a set number of things you use no matter what type of job you’re working on? FRANK: I use the same things no matter what I’m doing. My paper of choice is Stratford Bristol board, vellum surface, 300 series. It has a slight tooth which I like. I use a regular mechanical pencil—a 0.7mm Pentel P207. MM: Do you like a softer lead or a harder lead?

MM: Do you do warmup sketches?

FRANK: I use whatever lead is in the mechanical pencil. [laughter] The lead that I use is the Pentel 0.7 refill leads, medium HB hardness. For inking, I use Micron Pigma pens, three sizes: 01, 05, and 08. I use the 08 for everything, and use 01 and 05 for details. To fill in large black areas, I use #2 watercolor brush with Speedball Super Black India ink.

FRANK: I just jump into it. I know that Mike Wieringo used to do a lot of warm-up drawings, but I could never do that. I just jump into it, and if I make a mistake, I just erase it. [laughter] I’m not really a morning person, so I don’t do a lot of drawing in the morning. I try to, but I usually end up just reading a script and doing a lot of writing. Maybe block out figures, make calls, and stuff like that. From 1:00 to 2:00, I grab something to eat and then usually end up taking a nap. Around 3:00, I walk down to the bus stop and wait for Emily to get

MM: So you don’t do any feathering with the brush? FRANK: No, no, I just don’t have the patience. 69

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Modern Masters Vol. 14: Frank Cho