Direct Exam Transcript of Lt. John Fisk Seattle Fire Department

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1

and face me.

2 3 4 5 6

LT. JOHN FISK, having been duly sworn on oath, was examined and testified as follows herein: THE COURT:

Go right ahead and be seated in the

7

chair closest to me.

8

pull that mic so it's in your direction, it's close to

9

your mouth.

We will hear you well.

10

THE WITNESS:

11

THE COURT:

12

screen.

Once you're comfortable, just

Does that work?

I think so.

Off to your left there's a

You might be asked to look at that as you go.

13

Ms. Koehler.

14

MS. KOEHLER:

Thank you, your Honor.

Before we

15

begin, the plaintiffs would like to move for admission

16

of Exhibit Number 1, page 2210 and 2211.

17

THE COURT:

18

MR. WAKEFIELD:

19 20 21 22 23

Any objection to 2210 and 2211?

If they're for illustrative

purposes, no objection.

THE COURT:

They're both admitted for illustrative

purposes.

MS. KOEHLER:

Thank you, your Honor.

(Ex. No. 1, 2210, 2211 admitted)

24 25

DIRECT EXAMINATION KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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BY MS. KOEHLER: Q.

Lieutenant, can you state your name for the record,

3

spell your last name, and give us your business

4

address, please.

5

A.

6

My name's John Fisk, F-I-S-K, and my business address is 325 9th Avenue, Seattle, Washington.

7

Q.

And what is your role?

8

A.

I'm a medical service officer, permanent lieutenant,

9

with Battalion 3, the medic program, with the Seattle

10 11

Fire Department.

Q.

Lieutenant Fisk, I'm going to -- because of your role,

12

I'm going to ask you some detailed questions about the

13

MCI process, but, before that, if you could just give

14

us some background information about you, and how you

15

came to hold this role and for how long you've held it?

16

A.

Yeah.

I joined the Seattle Fire Department in 1986,

17

'87, and held the role of firefighter for three years.

18

I then tested to get into the medic program, worked

19

as a medic for about 17 years, and then took the

20

lieutenant's exam to become a medical service officer,

21

which is the position I hold right now.

22

Q.

I understand that you are in department number 3?

23

A.

Battalion 3, yeah.

24

Q.

Battalion 3.

25

A.

So the city is divided into geographical areas, called

Tell us where the battalion is located.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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battalions.

Battalion 3 is not a geographical area,

2

it's kind of an entity unto itself.

3

program that encompasses all of the ALS care for the

4

city.

It's the medic

5

Q.

Where are you physically located?

6

A.

Physically located at Harborview Hospital.

7

Q.

How many other fire departments have a location in a

8

hospital, nationwide?

9

A.

As far as I know, we're the only one.

10

Q.

All right.

So at the -- for tech medics in the State

11

of Washington, how are they trained -- well, I'm sorry,

12

in King County?

13

A.

The King County paramedics are all trained at

14

Harborview through, originally, University of

15

Washington paramedic training program, and it's now

16

certified by the State of Washington.

17

entities in King County proper and in some areas

18

outside are all trained by the program staff at

19

Harborview.

But all of the

20

Q.

And this is a mandatory training; am I right?

21

A.

To be employed in King County, yes.

22

Q.

And it's about ten months?

23

A.

Correct.

24

Q.

So at Harborview, where you were located, I want to

25

talk about a couple different structural things.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

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of all, what is an MCI?

2

and I'm going to go through it so we can understand how

3

this -- some of the more details about how this

4

happened.

5 6

We know a little bit about it,

Tell us, please, what an MCI is?

A.

Certainly.

MCI's a multiple casualty incident,

7

anything involving a significant number of patients.

8

There are a large number of definitions that work for

9

different departments.

For us, basically, I would

10

attain the scope of MCI if it exceeds our normal

11

capabilities.

12

care that we would normally provide for one patient to

13

accommodate a number of patients, or if we are unable

14

to clear the scene rapidly of any number of patients,

15

we would have to implement our MCI protocols to

16

expedite transport to the hospital.

17

Q.

If we have to change the standard of

I'm going to show you what's been previously marked for

18

identification as Exhibit Number 1, page 2210, and I

19

took this out of your MCI manual, but this is your

20

organizational chart.

21

Can you just take us through -- we've heard from

22

firefighters, we've heard from -- we're going to hear

23

from you.

24

and show us where you would be on this group?

25

A.

Certainly.

Can you take us through the chain of command

So the incident commander might change KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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roles a couple times.

2

officer from whatever engine arrives.

3

assumed by the first responding battalion chief, and

4

maybe our on-duty division chief, depending on the size

5

of the incident.

6

Initially we're the first in It would then be

Under that there will be several categories,

7

including operations, which might be fire suppression,

8

rescue operations, and medical group.

9

may have branches, depending on how big the incident

10

gets.

11

Below that we

In this case we only had one branch, per se.

Below that we have a couple of categories directly

12

underneath the branch supervisor, and that was medical

13

group supervisor, and that was my role.

14

responsible for most of the medical component of an

15

incident for that particular branch.

16

Q.

All right.

So I'm

And then there's one other chart that --

17

well, I guess we can look at the next chart after I

18

talk to you a little about this.

19

So my understanding is that it was your day off, but

20

you were called in to Harborview to cover, and the call

21

came in; is that correct?

22

A.

Correct.

We have a lot of on-duty training.

We don't

23

like to take rigs out of service.

24

who was normally on duty was at a training program at

25

the University of Washington, actually, and I was KEVIN MOLL, CSR

So the lieutenant

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backfilling for a couple of hours while he was in the

2

training session.

3

like myself, so we're pretty interchangeable.

He's also a medical service officer,

4

Q.

When the call came in, who were you with?

5

A.

I happened to be talking with Lieutenant Craig Aman,

6

whose official role is the AMR contract liaison.

He

7

handles the BLS transport contract that we have with

8

American Medical Response at the time.

9

having a morning conversation over coffee when the

We were just

10

alarm came in, and so he was able to join me on the

11

run.

12

Q.

Again, just to slow it down a little bit, so the fire

13

department -- is it the fire department that has the

14

contract with AMR, which is the ambulance service, or

15

does City of Seattle?

16

A.

17 18

I would imagine the contract is proctored by the City of Seattle.

Q.

19

The fire department manages the contract.

So the fire department -- so this Lieutenant Aman would have a direct line to AMR; is that correct?

20

A.

Correct, and I do, as well.

21

Q.

All right.

22 23

And that would be important for MCI; is

that right?

A.

Certainly.

So one of the key components of an MCI with

24

multiple patients is rapid transport to the hospital.

25

Probably the best way that we can do that is to utilize KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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a private carrier like AMR, because we only have seven

2

medic units in the city, and probably four on-duty aid

3

cars.

4

patients, and so we rely on AMR.

5

event we might bring in other ambulance companies from

6

the area to help with transport.

7

Q.

8

In a very large-scale

I understand that as MCI has developed over the years you are focused on something called the golden hour.

9 10

They're not set up to transport volumes of

Can you tell us about the golden hour?

A.

It's pretty well accepted that for significant trauma

11

patients, if they don't arrive at an operating room

12

that is capable of handling major surgery, their

13

chances of survival will go down significantly.

14

try to prescribe to a very quick turnaround time.

15

When we evaluate a patient, treat them, and

So we

16

transport them, we try to stay, obviously, well within

17

that hour.

18

the emergency room, and then get them to the operating

19

suite.

20

to keep that well under an hour, if possible.

21

Q.

The hospital needs time to process them in

So all of that takes a bit of time, and we try

All right, so now, as a medical group supervisor,

22

taking up that role, I understand, also, that you would

23

-- that you would be responsible, as well, for the

24

DMCC.

25

Can you tell us what that stands for and what that KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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entails?

A.

Certainly.

I'm not really responsible for it, but help

3

with activation of it.

4

Control Center.

5

basically, a team of people in a specific room that

6

manage large-scale events like this, as far as patient

7

load goes.

8 9

So DMCC is the Disaster Medical

It's at Harborview, and it's,

They have what they call a census every morning, so they're aware of each hospital in the area and what

10

capacity they may be able to take, as far as patient

11

load.

12

They'll make early contact with those hospitals.

13

Assumedly, those hospitals would try to discharge as

14

many patients as possible, they would probably cancel

15

elective surgeries if they're able to, and prepare for

16

a large volume of patients.

17

all of the patients are transported to, in

18

communication with one of our people in the field.

19

And then they manage where

We have what's called a DMCC contact point in an MCI

20

like this.

We have several people assigned to tell the

21

ambulances where to go, what their destination will be.

22

We do some tracking at that point, as well, and that

23

person is in communication with a hospital, with the

24

DMCC people at the hospital, to get the destination for

25

those patients.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

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Q.

So at the time that you got the call, did you have an

2

understanding as to how many patients that Harborview

3

itself would be able to accept?

4

A.

Only a general idea.

It's pretty well accepted that

5

Harborview, being the regional trauma center, can

6

accept probably the first ten significantly injured

7

patients.

We call them red patients, highest category.

8

Beyond that, it depends on how busy they are, how

9

full the ER is, and, more importantly, how full the OR

10

is, if they have both staff and room available to treat

11

a large volume of patients.

12

Q.

Then there's one other concept I want to talk about,

13

before we get to what happened when you actually

14

arrived on scene, and that's exhibit -- same Number 1,

15

but the next page, 2211, and this is just an example

16

here of an MCI footprint, and can you tell us how you

17

come up with the MCI footprints, and then we'll talk

18

about what it was in this case?

19

A.

Yeah.

And I think this picture would be a little

20

misleading, in that this is a linear setup and they

21

never really occur that way, but the general concept is

22

we have the incidents, where things occur, which would

23

be, in this case, the hot zone, where the vehicles may

24

be in this case; the warm zone would be where actual

25

operations are going on, to extract people from that KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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scene.

2

the way there, under ideal circumstances; and then

3

moving down into a treatment area, would flow right

4

into a transportation corridor, under ideal

5

circumstances.

6

Hopefully we don't have apparatus and things in

The other areas, command posts may be slightly

7

removed or off to one side, so that they have an

8

overview and can kind of manage the scene.

9

Staging is where arriving apparatus and equipment

10

may be stored or staffed until they're needed at the

11

scene.

12

an ambulatory staging area, as well.

13

that a block or two away, just because of traffic

14

concerns, and we have to manage how vehicles arrive and

15

then exit the scene.

One thing I don't really see on here would be We probably have

16

The green patient area for, essentially, what we

17

call walking wounded, those who are either uninjured,

18

involved in the incident, or only have minor injuries.

19

We like to corral them off to the side somewhere so

20

that they're out of the initial incident, but that we

21

can continue to evaluate them, in case there were

22

injuries that are more significant than were first

23

identified.

24 25

The striped, black area would be for deceased patients.

We rarely have the opportunity to set that KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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up.

2

incident where there are deceased patients, he would

3

prefer that we don't remove them.

4

not to use our manpower and staffing on dealing with

5

those patients, when there's no benefit and there are

6

other injured red patients.

7

The medical examiner has determined that in an

And we would prefer

But on occasion we'll have someone who expires in a

8

red treatment area, and we'd prefer to move them to a

9

different area just for ease of the other people

10 11

involved in the incident.

Q.

When you then -- so you got in the car with Lieutenant

12

Aman, you arrived at the scene, and did you -- were you

13

able to take on the role that you've described to us

14

there?

15

A.

Yeah.

So once we arrived at the scene, I checked in at

16

the command post.

It's understood that that would be

17

my role, medical group supervisor.

18

the chiefs there that I'd assume that role, and at that

19

point I had a conversation with Craig and Lieutenant

20

Aman, assigned him to the transportation role, and I

21

went over to the treatment area to interface with the

22

two medics who were -- I guess, there were four medics

23

actually there, to get the scope of the incident, find

24

out what they needed, began to set up the

25

infrastructure for our MCI treatment.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

So I confirmed with

(206) 477-1584

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MS. KOEHLER:

2

So I would like permission for the

witness to approach, your Honor, and just --

3

THE COURT:

Here's the plan, Lieutenant.

Go ahead

4

and take a microphone in one hand and the pointer in

5

the other, and talk into the microphone so we can hear

6

you.

7

BY MS. KOEHLER:

8

Q.

9

So, Lieutenant, this is Exhibit Number 4, and if you would be so kind as to show us how the MCI was set up

10 11

Go ahead and step down.

by your department on that day.

A.

Certainly.

I guess, as far as a walk-through, I was

12

parked somewhere south of this point.

13

company wasn't there when I first arrived, but

14

Lieutenant Aman and I walked up this way, towards where

15

the command post was located.

16

Loud enough?

17

This truck

I'll talk into this.

Command post was located in this area.

I checked in

18

with them, and made my assignment as medical group

19

supervisor.

20

conversation nearby and identified probably the best

21

traffic corridor would be on the north end of the

22

bridge, and he went off to set that infrastructure up.

Lieutenant Aman then -- we had a

23

I then went over to the treatment area, somewhere in

24

this vicinity, where two of our medics, Carl Gordon and

25

Mark Chopa were, and got some information from them KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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about the scope of the incident and how many patients

2

they thought we had, as far as significantly injured

3

red patients, and yellow patients.

4

One of our members was either up in the Duck or in

5

the bus, Pat Kyles, and he had a better handle on

6

triage, and I think he ultimately reported that to Carl

7

Gordon, who then gave the information to me.

8

At that point I contacted DMCC, our doctor,

9

physician, who was in control of the incident, from a

10

medical standpoint, at Harborview, and gave him an

11

estimate of the number of patients we had, and told him

12

that further contact would then be via Craig Aman, who

13

would be talking to him to receive transportation

14

destination for all the patients.

15

Q.

Thank you.

16

A.

Is that it?

17

Q.

Yeah.

18

MS. KOEHLER:

So, your Honor, I would like to move

19

for the admission of Exhibit Number 643, which is for

20

illustrative purposes.

21

scene.

22

THE COURT:

23

MR. GUTHRIE:

24

THE COURT:

25

MR. GUTHRIE:

It's a video, showing the

All right.

Any objection?

403, your Honor.

Is it 403?

I'm sorry, basis for my objection to

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

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admission is Rule 403.

2

THE COURT:

Come into chambers and tell me about

3

that.

4

free to stand up, but, of course, don't chat with each

5

other.

6

Go ahead and relax, ladies and gentlemen.

(Chambers conference; not reported)

7

THE COURT:

Okay.

Let's let the lawyers get back to

8

their seats, and I'm overruling the objection.

9

publish when you're ready, Ms. Koehler.

10

MS. KOEHLER:

11

BY MS. KOEHLER:

12

Feel

Q.

You may

Thank you, your Honor.

So, Lieutenant, we are going to be -- and it will be on

13

your monitor.

14

just showing the scene, and if you can just wait till

15

it ends, and I'm going to ask you a couple questions

16

about what we're seeing.

17

(Audiovisual displayed)

18

MS. KOEHLER:

19

BY MS. KOEHLER:

20

Q.

21

Lieutenant Fisk, what we saw on here was from a

What do you see when you watch that?

23

25

Thank you, your Honor.

helicopter that came down.

22

24

We're going to be playing a short video,

Did you see

what you described to us?

A.

Yeah.

It looked like probably mid to late, through the

incident, as we were beginning to load patients in KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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ambulances on the north end.

It looked like we had a

2

Shoreline medic unit there, and I know it took them --

3

a little while for them to get there, so it must have

4

been later in the incident.

5

So it looks like initially we had two patients being

6

loaded into one of our Seattle Fire Department aid cars

7

and one into the Shoreline medic unit.

8

later in the video they were continuing to move

9

patients, it looked like, out of the yellow treatment

It looked like

10

area, so I'm assuming at that point most of the red

11

ones had already been transported.

12

Q.

13

So a couple more technical questions, and let's start off with the yellow and the red.

14

A.

Uh-huh.

15

Q.

How did -- how are you trained, or how are the medics,

16

paramedic-firefighters, trained to distinguish between

17

the red and the yellow, and then, between the red, how

18

to prioritize the red?

19

A.

Certainly.

So we, just for ease of organization, use

20

colors to identify the most significant, most

21

significant and what we would call delayed patients,

22

those were injured but can probably have delayed

23

transport, as far as priorities go, so the concept of

24

triage being to sort patients.

25

We'll take what are, obviously, badly injured KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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1

patients, and that could be a number of things, from

2

penetrating wounds to the torso, head wounds, breathing

3

irregularities, all kinds of different sorts of

4

injuries that might fall in a red category.

5

reason we lay out the tarps, so that if we don't have

6

transport vehicles available, that's a place where we

7

can begin treatment, hopefully stabilize them until a

8

transport vehicle's available to get them to the

9

hospital.

10

And the

As far as how we -- what criteria we use, through

11

the last, probably, 20 years, triage criteria has

12

changed dramatically, all over the world, really.

13

There's a number of systems in place, and we find that

14

a few of them work effectively at a scene, and we've

15

developed a system here that we call sick or not sick,

16

basically, and we rely on the experience of the EMTs

17

and the paramedics, based on the patients they've seen

18

in the past and their training, to rapidly identify a

19

patient as either red or yellow, just with a quick

20

eyeball.

21

vital signs; we don't assess a respiratory rate.

22

We don't assess a heart rate; we don't assess

We, basically, eyeball and we understand that it

23

doesn't have to be accurate.

24

retriaged frequently during the course of an incident.

25

Patients should be

Patients in a red zone may turn out to be more KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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1

stable than we thought, and may be moved to the yellow

2

zone to be delayed.

3

more badly injured or sicker, or worse, as time goes

4

on, and we may move them to the red treatment area for

5

higher priority transport.

Patients in the yellow zone may be

6

So our criteria's a little bit loose, but it's been

7

fairly effective for us to quickly, which is much more

8

important than accurately, I think, to triage patients

9

into red or yellow, in those general, broad categories.

10

Q.

Now, where was the green patient area in this photo?

11

A.

So I don't believe we had a formal green patient

12

collection area.

13

incident most of the green patients were off on the

14

west side of the bridge, on the sidewalk there, a

15

little bit down past that rescue rig that you see up

16

against the side -- sidewalk there, up and to the

17

north.

18

My recollection is that early in the

Ordinarily we would assign an engine company to

19

shepherd those people, and to constantly evaluate them.

20

As far as know, that happened early on, but I don't

21

know if they remained with them.

22

This is a fairly manpower-intensive event, so we

23

needed a lot of people working on extraction for the

24

patients.

25

Q.

And understanding, is that the response here was KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

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1

amazing, is there any -- was there any concern that, in

2

the future, maybe the green patients should not be left

3

on their own for so long?

4

A.

Oh, absolutely.

I think it's incumbent on us to make

5

sure that everyone is cared for.

6

uninjured-involved patients may be a drain on our

7

manpower, when it's better suited elsewhere.

8

have a function for law enforcement, as witnesses to

9

the event, which may be of more interest to the police

10 11

Truly,

They also

department than us.

We know that in -- this was a bit unique, being on a

12

bridge, that two things didn't happen.

Initially,

13

patients don't walk away and what we call self-refer

14

themselves to the hospital.

15

mechanism for them to get on a bus or something to get

16

themselves to the hospital.

17

we have downtown, when we have like a bus accident and

18

people get on, to be injured and end up in court, so

19

that wasn't possible here, either, which was fortunate

20

for us.

There's really no

And the other phenomenon

21

It's a problem, I think, with all MCIs, especially

22

from our initial response, that it's incumbent on us to

23

address the injured -- badly injured patients, and the

24

green, uninjured, perhaps, get ignored for a period of

25

time.

I think that just comes with the territory.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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1

It's still our responsibility at some point to corral

2

them and evaluate them, more from a medical standpoint,

3

but we could have done better here.

4

Q.

So what role, if any, did the number of people that did

5

not speak English have on this effort in identifying

6

sick or not sick?

7

A.

I would have to say very little.

We're quite used to

8

dealing with patients who are either unable to

9

communicate for whatever reason, whether they're

10

unconscious or not.

11

bearing on identifying a red patient.

12

are usually evident.

13

wrong.

14

presentation, figure out whether they're yellow or red,

15

so I would say that had very little, if any, bearing.

16

Q.

That usually has very little Their injuries

They don't need to tell us what's

We can usually see, and from their

The most bearing it would have probably would be on the

17

lesser injured people that you couldn't see anything

18

obviously on them?

19

A.

True.

And I -- probably the biggest hurdle would be

20

just demographic information, a patient age and family

21

members, things like that.

22

Q.

Okay.

So one more technical issue.

So in the effort

23

that we've seen on the video, and we've seen many

24

pictures up, and we'll see a couple more, because I

25

want to identify you in the area, what happens to KEVIN MOLL, CSR

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recordkeeping?

A.

So on a daily basis we have a very high standard for

3

the recordkeeping.

We have what's called an EPCR, an

4

electronic patient care record, that we do for every

5

patient we see.

6

understand and have designed into our MCI plan that if

7

we were to do that on a scene like this, we would

8

literally compromise patients's lives for the sake of

9

recordkeeping.

That's the gold standard.

We

So understanding that, we have a

10

tracking system in place to at least put a unique

11

identifier with each patient, which, even then is

12

probably only valuable for data gathering.

13

bearing on patient care at all.

It has no

14

But we just don't employ it, because in the future

15

it may be that some of the data we gather may help us

16

be more successful for future events.

17

right now that patient tracking and data monitoring and

18

information gathering and recordkeeping compromise our

19

efforts to save lives, so we recognize on a major

20

incident like this that we won't do any form of formal

21

recordkeeping.

22

But we recognize

If possible, whatever transporting entity is taking

23

the patient to the hospital may start a record.

24

different organizations, like AMR, who does not use the

25

same recordkeeping system that we use, so there is some KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

We use

5321

1

interchange ability, but it's not smooth.

2

I think that's, you know, potentially resolvable in

3

the future, but it really has no bearing on patient

4

outcome.

5

Q.

6

So the next exhibit -- my computer just froze, which never happens.

My apologies.

One moment.

7

This is Exhibit Number 2, page one, and this is the

8

-- I guess, the final report, after the incident, when

9

you were going back over it.

10

Can you, using this -- and, again, if you could

11

approach and explain, if you could show us things like

12

the transportation corridors, where the engines were,

13

and then what the transports mean.

14

explain this diagram for the jury, that would be --

If you can just

15

A.

Sure.

From here, or do you want me to come over there?

16

Q.

No.

17

A.

Okay.

18

Q.

Thank you.

19

A.

So the transportation corridors were -- initially the

You'll be right here.

20

north one was set up in this area.

21

up here, so I can only assume that it was in this

22

general vicinity.

23

I wasn't physically

The ambulance would come in from the north end of

24

the bridge, drive down as far as they could, make a

25

U-turn back in, and get loaded, hopefully, two or three KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

5322

1

abreast, I know, on some occasions, and then leave the

2

scene and find their way back up to their receiving

3

hospitals.

4

Later in the incident we set up a south transport

5

point, essentially, where this medic would be, that was

6

after Lieutenant Barokas arrived at the scene, and

7

established this area.

8

from the south end, I think, mostly at the northbound

9

lanes.

10

We had ambulances coming in

They also would turn around here, back in here,

get loaded, and then leave for the hospital.

11

Do you want me to address the patient transports?

12

Q.

Yes, please.

13

A.

So the upper row represents the red, or most

14

significantly injured patients, this diagram showing 12

15

of them.

16

transported from the north transfer point later, about

17

one or two left from the south transfer point.

18

the yellows went to other hospitals along with red

19

patients.

20

I believe the majority of them were

Some of

Most ambulances can take, sometimes, two patients,

21

sometimes three, if they're able to sit.

22

had at least one or two ambulances that had a person on

23

the front seat, as well as a person on a stretcher, one

24

on a bench seat, in the back of the ambulance.

25

I think we

The green patients, I assume these were all the ones KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

5323

1

that were at least evaluated at a local hospital.

2

majority of them went as a second or third rider in

3

most of the ambulances that transported yellow patients

4

later, and then a significant number of them -- I

5

believe six or seven, at least -- went with our mobile

6

ambulance bus to Northwest Hospital for evaluation very

7

late in the incident, kind of the last ones to leave.

8 9

The

Does that answer what you need?

Q.

Yes.

Thank you very much.

Lieutenant, looking at

10

Exhibit 5, page 2293, this has been previously

11

admitted, do you see yourself in this photograph?

12

sorry, just one moment.

13

screen.

Oh,

It will come up on your

14

A.

Yes.

15

Q.

And is this -- you're standing at the red tarp area, so

16

I'm on the very right of it, in the orange vest.

this is in the warm zone; is that right?

17

A.

Yeah, that would definitely be in the warm zone.

18

Q.

And then I have one more.

19

A.

Correct, on the very right side, in the orange vest,

20 21

again.

Q.

22 23

That's you, also?

All right.

Lieutenant, did your department do a

fantastic job?

A.

I think so.

24

MS. KOEHLER:

25

THE COURT:

No further questions.

Thank you.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

Thank you.

Mr. Wakefield.

(206) 477-1584

5324

1

MR. WAKEFIELD:

Thank you.

2

CROSS-EXAMINATION

3 4

BY MR. WAKEFIELD: Q.

5

Good morning, Lieutenant Fisk. service.

6

Thank you for your

I just have a couple of questions for you.

The green patients at this scene sort of

7

self-selected, didn't they, the people that were on the

8

west side of the bridge?

9

A.

That would be the expectation, yes.

10

Q.

Okay.

11

A.

Just based on our post report, and the numbers on the

12 13

And do you know how many of those there were?

chart.

Q.

And the numbers on the chart, I think, were green

14

patients that were transported, but there were also

15

green patients that physically walked off the bridge.

16

You're aware of that, correct?

17

A.

Correct, and I don't know what that number is.

18

Q.

Would it surprise you to learn that that was about 25

19 20

students, mostly, that all walked off the bridge?

A.

No, it wouldn't surprise me.

21

MR. WAKEFIELD:

22

THE COURT:

23

MR. GUTHRIE:

24

THE COURT:

25

MR. PUZ:

Thank you.

That's all I have.

Thanks, Mr. Wakefield.

Mr. Guthrie.

No questions, your Honor.

Mr. Puz?

No questions, your Honor.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

5325

1

THE COURT:

Mr. Seder or Ms. Lee?

2

MS. LEE:

3

THE COURT:

4

MS. KOEHLER:

5

THE COURT:

No questions, your Honor.

Thank you.

Anything more, Ms. Koehler?

No, your Honor.

Pass your question forms to the end of

6

the jury box, ladies and gentlemen.

7

we'll see if the jury has any questions for you.

8

(Chambers conference; not reported)

9

THE COURT:

10

All right.

JURY QUESTIONS

12

BY THE COURT: Q.

14 15

Lieutenant, one question for

you from a juror.

11

13

At this time,

There were four fatalities on scene.

Do you know where

these fatalities were located, on the bus, on the Duck?

A.

The best of my recollection is at least two were on the

16

bus.

17

were removed and in the treatment area at one point and

18

expired there.

19

were located, no.

20

The other two, I can't say, for certain.

THE COURT:

So I can't tell you exactly where they

Thank you.

21

you, Ms. Koehler?

22

MS. KOEHLER:

23

THE COURT:

24 25

They

Follow-up questions from

No, your Honor.

Follow-up questions from you,

Mr. Wakefield?

MR. WAKEFIELD:

No.

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584

5326

1

THE COURT:

2

MR. GUTHRIE:

3

THE COURT:

4

MR. PUZ:

5

THE COURT:

6

MS. LEE:

7

THE COURT:

8

You're all done.

9 10

Mr. Guthrie?

No, your Honor.

Mr. Puz? None, your Honor.

Ms. Lee? No, your Honor.

Thank you.

Go ahead and step down.

Thanks for being here.

The plaintiff may call its next witness.

MS. KOEHLER:

Yes, Your Honor.

11

call Fenna Zielinski.

12

Honor.

13

Thank you.

THE COURT:

The plaintiff will

She has an interpreter, your

Please take your time, Ms. Zielinski.

14

Why don't we go ahead and get you seated, and then you

15

can look at me and raise your right hand.

16

be seated.

17

me.

18

Come on back.

Go ahead and

Sit in the chair closest to

Take your time.

Go ahead and sit down.

We'll have the interpreter

19

be seated.

20

FENNA ZIELINSKI HOFSTEE, having been duly sworn on oath, was examined and testified as follows herein:

21

Just look at me and raise your right hand.

22

THE WITNESS:

23

THE COURT:

24 25

Yeah.

Yep, I swear.

Be seated.

Could we have the

interpreter identify herself and her qualifications.

THE INTERPRETER:

Anne Mieke Klock, K-L-O-K, Dutch

KEVIN MOLL, CSR

(206) 477-1584