IDW: The First Decade Chapter 14

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THE FIRST DECADE

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14 ANGEL C

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IDW started publishing comics based on Angel in 2005

at the suggestion of Jeff Mariotte, who was the company’s Editor-in-Chief at the time. Jeff was very

familiar with the property, having already written several prose novels based on the show. He also wrote

IDW’s first series, Angel: The Curse. Over the next several

years, IDW would publish a variety of miniseries and

one-shots based on Angel, including several that focused

on the popular character Spike.

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14 ANGEL C

H

A

P

T

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IDW started publishing comics based on Angel in 2005

at the suggestion of Jeff Mariotte, who was the company’s Editor-in-Chief at the time. Jeff was very

familiar with the property, having already written several prose novels based on the show. He also wrote

IDW’s first series, Angel: The Curse. Over the next several

years, IDW would publish a variety of miniseries and

one-shots based on Angel, including several that focused

on the popular character Spike.

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In 2007, Brian Lynch, the writer of IDW’s Spike: Aslyum and Spike: Shadow Puppets, was chosen by the show’s co-creator, Joss Whedon, to write a story that would officially take place after the end of the show.

That idea became Angel: After the Fall and launched in November 2007–a series that quickly became one of IDW’s best-selling titles.

• • • • Ted and Brian discuss Angel: After the Fall, including Brian’s meeting with Whedon.

TA: I know that comic-book writing isn’t your main gig.

What is your day job, Brian?

BL: My day job is screenwriting. I’m currently working on the Puss in Boots movie for Dreamworks– a spin-off from Shrek. I’ve also done TV shows for Fox and Warner Brothers but it’s always the same type of stuff, either comedy or horror/comedy. That’s why the IDW stuff worked out so well, I think.

real low-budget movie called Big Helium Dog. When he started the Movie Poop Shoot site, he asked me to do comics for it and Chris was running it at the time.

So, Chris and I met online through that and in person at the San Diego Comic Convention for the first time a couple of years later.

TA: And, I think you knew Kevin Smith and that’s how you met Chris. [Chris Ryall ran Kevin Smith’s Web site, moviepoopshoot.com, before he came to work for IDW].

TA: Were you a fan of the Angel TV show before Chris talked to you about writing the comics?

BL: That’s right. Kevin was a friend of mine after I worked on a movie he produced called A Better Place. He also produced a movie I wrote and directed, a

BL: Absolutely. And Chris knew I was because in a lot of the comic strips I would do for Poop Shoot there were Angel and Buffy references. So, Chris knew that I knew my stuff because they were very specific references that only a complete geek would know.

TA: I recently re-read Spike: Asylum and Spike: Shadow Puppets and you have a very confident take on the characters, particularly with Spike. You really get the characters and the dialogue is dead-on. What was the reaction from the fans when Spike: Asylum came out?

BL: In the beginning, when it was announced, all they wanted to know was whether or not it was canon, whether or not it was Joss-approved, or what episode the storyline fit in between. But once the first issue came out, they were won over fairly quickly and it was a great feeling. It was really nice and from then on they’ve been nothing but the most supportive people. Even when they had questions and they didn’t know whether or not it had Whedon’s stamp of approval on it, they were still excited to read it.

But they wanted to know, I guess, whether or not it

________________________________________________________________ These Pages and Previous Pages: Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

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In 2007, Brian Lynch, the writer of IDW’s Spike: Aslyum and Spike: Shadow Puppets, was chosen by the show’s co-creator, Joss Whedon, to write a story that would officially take place after the end of the show.

That idea became Angel: After the Fall and launched in November 2007–a series that quickly became one of IDW’s best-selling titles.

• • • • Ted and Brian discuss Angel: After the Fall, including Brian’s meeting with Whedon.

TA: I know that comic-book writing isn’t your main gig.

What is your day job, Brian?

BL: My day job is screenwriting. I’m currently working on the Puss in Boots movie for Dreamworks– a spin-off from Shrek. I’ve also done TV shows for Fox and Warner Brothers but it’s always the same type of stuff, either comedy or horror/comedy. That’s why the IDW stuff worked out so well, I think.

real low-budget movie called Big Helium Dog. When he started the Movie Poop Shoot site, he asked me to do comics for it and Chris was running it at the time.

So, Chris and I met online through that and in person at the San Diego Comic Convention for the first time a couple of years later.

TA: And, I think you knew Kevin Smith and that’s how you met Chris. [Chris Ryall ran Kevin Smith’s Web site, moviepoopshoot.com, before he came to work for IDW].

TA: Were you a fan of the Angel TV show before Chris talked to you about writing the comics?

BL: That’s right. Kevin was a friend of mine after I worked on a movie he produced called A Better Place. He also produced a movie I wrote and directed, a

BL: Absolutely. And Chris knew I was because in a lot of the comic strips I would do for Poop Shoot there were Angel and Buffy references. So, Chris knew that I knew my stuff because they were very specific references that only a complete geek would know.

TA: I recently re-read Spike: Asylum and Spike: Shadow Puppets and you have a very confident take on the characters, particularly with Spike. You really get the characters and the dialogue is dead-on. What was the reaction from the fans when Spike: Asylum came out?

BL: In the beginning, when it was announced, all they wanted to know was whether or not it was canon, whether or not it was Joss-approved, or what episode the storyline fit in between. But once the first issue came out, they were won over fairly quickly and it was a great feeling. It was really nice and from then on they’ve been nothing but the most supportive people. Even when they had questions and they didn’t know whether or not it had Whedon’s stamp of approval on it, they were still excited to read it.

But they wanted to know, I guess, whether or not it

________________________________________________________________ These Pages and Previous Pages: Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

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should have a higher place on their bookshelf–if it was canon or not.

But either way, they were going to read it. It was whether or not they should pick it apart and get characters tattooed from it on their body.

TA: Spike: Asylum led into Spike: Shadow Puppets, which clearly is a spin-out from the “Smile Time” episode.

Was that an idea you had or was that something that Chris approached you with?

BL: I definitely wanted to make Spike a puppet at one point because I love the Muppets. One of the first screenplays I sold was an original Muppets script that I just wrote for fun and Henson found out about it and bought it from me. So, I know I brought up the idea to do a “Spike as a puppet” series. Chris was thinking something along the same lines–as a sequel to “Smile Time”–so that fit perfectly.

TA: Did you get the same kind of response from the fans? Were they curious if it was canon?

BL: You know, they did. They definitely wanted to know but at the same time, at this point, I was ready for them. I knew that was going to be a question so in the very first issue we had Spike literally declaring that he doesn’t like official canon. Meaning, not that he doesn’t like the show–that wasn’t my message to the fans, like “I hate the show”–it was that I hate talking about whether or not it’s official canon. So, from that point on, I kind of won them over. I think they said, “Let’s just go along for the ride. Let’s just enjoy it and not worry about it.” So, of course, there are thousands of people that are worrying about it right now and are probably mad that I’m saying this.

TA: And that leads us to Angel: After the Fall, comics that are officially Joss Whedon-approved canon. How did you meet Joss?

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__________________________ Opposite Page: Spike: Asylum art by Franco Urru.

BL: It was really strange. I was waiting outside of a restaurant for my friends the day before Spike: Asylum #1 came out and he walked out. Normally, even if I’m a big fan, I never bother anyone. Joss is, obviously, a huge hero of mine but if Spike: Asylum wasn’t coming out, I would have let him walk right by and not annoyed him. But, I just walked up and told him what I did and I shook his hand and I said, “I have a book called Spike: Asylum coming out tomorrow. I hope if you do read it, you like it.” And he said, “Oh, okay, I’ll look for it.” He was really nice. I was talking a mile a minute, the words were just coming out but he completely humored me and was really warm, a sweet guy, and then he went on with his day.

But, I didn’t eat breakfast with my friends. I just sat and watched them because I couldn’t eat at that point.

I was just so excited and I was playing the conversation back in my head trying to remember whether or not I said something

________________________ This Page: Spike: Shadow Puppets art by Franco Urru.

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should have a higher place on their bookshelf–if it was canon or not.

But either way, they were going to read it. It was whether or not they should pick it apart and get characters tattooed from it on their body.

TA: Spike: Asylum led into Spike: Shadow Puppets, which clearly is a spin-out from the “Smile Time” episode.

Was that an idea you had or was that something that Chris approached you with?

BL: I definitely wanted to make Spike a puppet at one point because I love the Muppets. One of the first screenplays I sold was an original Muppets script that I just wrote for fun and Henson found out about it and bought it from me. So, I know I brought up the idea to do a “Spike as a puppet” series. Chris was thinking something along the same lines–as a sequel to “Smile Time”–so that fit perfectly.

TA: Did you get the same kind of response from the fans? Were they curious if it was canon?

BL: You know, they did. They definitely wanted to know but at the same time, at this point, I was ready for them. I knew that was going to be a question so in the very first issue we had Spike literally declaring that he doesn’t like official canon. Meaning, not that he doesn’t like the show–that wasn’t my message to the fans, like “I hate the show”–it was that I hate talking about whether or not it’s official canon. So, from that point on, I kind of won them over. I think they said, “Let’s just go along for the ride. Let’s just enjoy it and not worry about it.” So, of course, there are thousands of people that are worrying about it right now and are probably mad that I’m saying this.

TA: And that leads us to Angel: After the Fall, comics that are officially Joss Whedon-approved canon. How did you meet Joss?

194

__________________________ Opposite Page: Spike: Asylum art by Franco Urru.

BL: It was really strange. I was waiting outside of a restaurant for my friends the day before Spike: Asylum #1 came out and he walked out. Normally, even if I’m a big fan, I never bother anyone. Joss is, obviously, a huge hero of mine but if Spike: Asylum wasn’t coming out, I would have let him walk right by and not annoyed him. But, I just walked up and told him what I did and I shook his hand and I said, “I have a book called Spike: Asylum coming out tomorrow. I hope if you do read it, you like it.” And he said, “Oh, okay, I’ll look for it.” He was really nice. I was talking a mile a minute, the words were just coming out but he completely humored me and was really warm, a sweet guy, and then he went on with his day.

But, I didn’t eat breakfast with my friends. I just sat and watched them because I couldn’t eat at that point.

I was just so excited and I was playing the conversation back in my head trying to remember whether or not I said something

________________________ This Page: Spike: Shadow Puppets art by Franco Urru.

195

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embarrassing. But then, about a month later, Joss contacted Chris. He did read it and he said, “I think that Brian’s voice is good for doing the official continuation.” That’s among the best e-mails I’ve ever gotten and thank God I went to breakfast that morning.

TA: Yeah, no kidding. It’s funny how such a fortuitous thing happened from such a casual encounter.

BL: I mean, if I had chosen any other restaurant in L.A., who knows? Although maybe Spielberg would have been eating there and I would be writing Indiana Jones 5 right now.

with. I could see from the look on his face which ones clicked with him and which ones to let go. But then, at that point, I just wrote up my first take on it, a big outline, not even dividing it in issues. He sent it back, circling everything he liked but basically saying, “I know you’re a fan but don’t worry about shaking things up. Do whatever you want. Really go nuts with it. Run the characters through the mill–if they’re going to Hell, really send them to Hell and take more chances.” So, that was the best thing in the world, to have the creator of the characters say, “Go crazy, you’re being too tame.”

TA: What happened next?

BL: We went back to the same restaurant about a month later and we sat down for a couple of hours and he told me everything they were going to do if season six had happened on TV. And then he threw out a bunch of ideas that he said, “Well, now that we’re in the comic universe, we can get away with a lot more in terms of having an unlimited budget.” So, that’s how Angel having the dragon came about.

From that point on, I threw out ideas and characters I wanted to work 196

_______________________________ Top of the Page: Angel: After the Fall art by Franco Urru.

__________________________________________ Angel: After the Fall #1 Rare Cover for Brian and Carrie Lynch’s Wedding art by Franco Urru.

Angel was not a human in the original take and then I thought, “There’s got to be a good twist for Angel.” I remember sitting down with my wife, who doesn’t watch the show but she works as an executive on movies so she’s good with story, and she said, “What’s the worst thing that could happen to Angel in this situation?” And I answered, “It would be that he’s powerless to help all the people. They’ve gone to Hell and he’s powerless to help them.” So, I decided to make Angel human. And then I thought, “Maybe Joss is going to fire me because it’s such a stupid idea. It’s _______________________________ Opposite Page: Angel: After the Fall art by Franco Urru.

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embarrassing. But then, about a month later, Joss contacted Chris. He did read it and he said, “I think that Brian’s voice is good for doing the official continuation.” That’s among the best e-mails I’ve ever gotten and thank God I went to breakfast that morning.

TA: Yeah, no kidding. It’s funny how such a fortuitous thing happened from such a casual encounter.

BL: I mean, if I had chosen any other restaurant in L.A., who knows? Although maybe Spielberg would have been eating there and I would be writing Indiana Jones 5 right now.

with. I could see from the look on his face which ones clicked with him and which ones to let go. But then, at that point, I just wrote up my first take on it, a big outline, not even dividing it in issues. He sent it back, circling everything he liked but basically saying, “I know you’re a fan but don’t worry about shaking things up. Do whatever you want. Really go nuts with it. Run the characters through the mill–if they’re going to Hell, really send them to Hell and take more chances.” So, that was the best thing in the world, to have the creator of the characters say, “Go crazy, you’re being too tame.”

TA: What happened next?

BL: We went back to the same restaurant about a month later and we sat down for a couple of hours and he told me everything they were going to do if season six had happened on TV. And then he threw out a bunch of ideas that he said, “Well, now that we’re in the comic universe, we can get away with a lot more in terms of having an unlimited budget.” So, that’s how Angel having the dragon came about.

From that point on, I threw out ideas and characters I wanted to work 196

_______________________________ Top of the Page: Angel: After the Fall art by Franco Urru.

__________________________________________ Angel: After the Fall #1 Rare Cover for Brian and Carrie Lynch’s Wedding art by Franco Urru.

Angel was not a human in the original take and then I thought, “There’s got to be a good twist for Angel.” I remember sitting down with my wife, who doesn’t watch the show but she works as an executive on movies so she’s good with story, and she said, “What’s the worst thing that could happen to Angel in this situation?” And I answered, “It would be that he’s powerless to help all the people. They’ve gone to Hell and he’s powerless to help them.” So, I decided to make Angel human. And then I thought, “Maybe Joss is going to fire me because it’s such a stupid idea. It’s _______________________________ Opposite Page: Angel: After the Fall art by Franco Urru.

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either a great idea or it’s the worst idea.” It’s basically if we had the character of Batman and we’re not putting him in the suit for the whole run. So, Joss could either go, “You’re crazy,” or “Yes, that’s great.”

He sent an e-mail back very quickly and said, “That’s it–that’s what has to happen. You’ve nailed it.” He said, “We wanted to do that on the show for a long time but we couldn’t come up with a situation where it would work.” So, all this stuff is going on around the town that he’s been working to save. They, literally, went to Hell because of him–all these people are dying, his friends are

off in different directions and need his help but he has no power to help them. So, that was the starting point for the series. From that point on, everything kind of clicked into place once we figured out that was going to be Angel’s story.

TA: Once you knew where Angel was going to be, you could figure out how the other characters are going to play out and Spike ended up being an important part of the story.

BL: Absolutely. Because I’d previously done the two Spike series, when I was announced as the writer of Angel: After the Fall, a lot of people were scared that it was going to be Angel and Spike sharing the spotlight. Like they were going to be partners–they were concerned it wasn’t going to be Angel’s comic. As a result of that, I wanted to show people that it wasn’t going to be that way, so Spike kind of got the shaft early on.

And then, when you guys said, “Do you have any ideas for a spin-off,” Spike: After the Fall was the one that it had to be. We put Spike through some weird moments in the first couple of issues and, because it was Angel’s story, we didn’t really get to see why Spike was in that weird place and doing these things that are out of character for him. So, thank God that happened, because everything seemed to click and not only were we able to flesh out things that I should have done earlier in Angel: After the Fall, it was a great chance to show that Spike is still a hero and this is why he’s doing the things that may seem weird in the main series.

TA: That’s one of the nice things about the commercial success of the book, it gave us the freedom to expand the storyline. Success is often hard to come by in the world of comics.

BL: And when it happens, it’s a great feeling–but you want to see what clicked and you want to make it click again.

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___________________________________________ This Page and Opposite Page: Angel: Old Friends art by David Messina.

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either a great idea or it’s the worst idea.” It’s basically if we had the character of Batman and we’re not putting him in the suit for the whole run. So, Joss could either go, “You’re crazy,” or “Yes, that’s great.”

He sent an e-mail back very quickly and said, “That’s it–that’s what has to happen. You’ve nailed it.” He said, “We wanted to do that on the show for a long time but we couldn’t come up with a situation where it would work.” So, all this stuff is going on around the town that he’s been working to save. They, literally, went to Hell because of him–all these people are dying, his friends are

off in different directions and need his help but he has no power to help them. So, that was the starting point for the series. From that point on, everything kind of clicked into place once we figured out that was going to be Angel’s story.

TA: Once you knew where Angel was going to be, you could figure out how the other characters are going to play out and Spike ended up being an important part of the story.

BL: Absolutely. Because I’d previously done the two Spike series, when I was announced as the writer of Angel: After the Fall, a lot of people were scared that it was going to be Angel and Spike sharing the spotlight. Like they were going to be partners–they were concerned it wasn’t going to be Angel’s comic. As a result of that, I wanted to show people that it wasn’t going to be that way, so Spike kind of got the shaft early on.

And then, when you guys said, “Do you have any ideas for a spin-off,” Spike: After the Fall was the one that it had to be. We put Spike through some weird moments in the first couple of issues and, because it was Angel’s story, we didn’t really get to see why Spike was in that weird place and doing these things that are out of character for him. So, thank God that happened, because everything seemed to click and not only were we able to flesh out things that I should have done earlier in Angel: After the Fall, it was a great chance to show that Spike is still a hero and this is why he’s doing the things that may seem weird in the main series.

TA: That’s one of the nice things about the commercial success of the book, it gave us the freedom to expand the storyline. Success is often hard to come by in the world of comics.

BL: And when it happens, it’s a great feeling–but you want to see what clicked and you want to make it click again.

198

___________________________________________ This Page and Opposite Page: Angel: Old Friends art by David Messina.

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TA: Right. It’s nice to feel like you’re doing something that people really like. Usually in comics, the sales decline with every issue–so, issue four sells worse than issue three and issue five sells worse than issue four. But with Angel: After the Fall, we saw sales increasing between issues three and four and we eventually reached a really nice level plateau. It was clear that this was the number of people buying this comic on a monthly basis.

BL: That’s cool. And I hope they were buying and reading it. That’s the big thing.

TA: I think they were. People weren’t just buying this to put it in a bag and a box. I think that people really were reading it and enjoying it.

BL: I can take bad reviews but the worst thing is when nobody talks about it. I love when people are discussing it–good or bad–and with Angel: After the Fall, every panel gets dissected. That’s awesome. It’s a pretty good feeling.

TA: I tell everybody at IDW that you’ve got to have thick skin to work in this business. With any creative endeavor, the feedback can sometimes be pretty tough but when you’re talking about something that’s as beloved as Joss and Angel, the fans can be tough.

BL: I agree completely. I’ve gotten e-mail threats–not death threats but threats–because of things I’ve done to the characters. Which is really weird. You know what, I would definitely not be sending threats to people but I would be very passionate about the series even if I had nothing to do with it. So, I get it.

I get why they get upset or they get excited because I get excited about books that I really enjoy. So I understand it. It’s a big responsibility, it’s cool. It’s a good feeling.

TA: As we’re talking today, you recently finished the last issue of Angel: After the Fall. How’s that feel?

BL: I think I finished the last issue on Christmas Day and I took a week break and I thought, “I’m not going to have to do that again for months. And then,

200

___________________________________ Angel: Old Friends art by David Messina.

I just told Chris two or three days ago that I wrote eight or nine pages of an Angel book. I had an idea and I thought, “I have to do this.” I wanted to get it on paper. And Chris said, “You can’t quit us.” And I said, “I know.” I love these characters.

TA: That’s great news. We can’t wait to have you back. The door here is wide open and not just for Angel, but for whatever you’d like to do. Although we’re certainly anxious to have you back on Angel and Spike.

BL: Thank you so much, that’s cool.

IDW

_________________________________ Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

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TA: Right. It’s nice to feel like you’re doing something that people really like. Usually in comics, the sales decline with every issue–so, issue four sells worse than issue three and issue five sells worse than issue four. But with Angel: After the Fall, we saw sales increasing between issues three and four and we eventually reached a really nice level plateau. It was clear that this was the number of people buying this comic on a monthly basis.

BL: That’s cool. And I hope they were buying and reading it. That’s the big thing.

TA: I think they were. People weren’t just buying this to put it in a bag and a box. I think that people really were reading it and enjoying it.

BL: I can take bad reviews but the worst thing is when nobody talks about it. I love when people are discussing it–good or bad–and with Angel: After the Fall, every panel gets dissected. That’s awesome. It’s a pretty good feeling.

TA: I tell everybody at IDW that you’ve got to have thick skin to work in this business. With any creative endeavor, the feedback can sometimes be pretty tough but when you’re talking about something that’s as beloved as Joss and Angel, the fans can be tough.

BL: I agree completely. I’ve gotten e-mail threats–not death threats but threats–because of things I’ve done to the characters. Which is really weird. You know what, I would definitely not be sending threats to people but I would be very passionate about the series even if I had nothing to do with it. So, I get it.

I get why they get upset or they get excited because I get excited about books that I really enjoy. So I understand it. It’s a big responsibility, it’s cool. It’s a good feeling.

TA: As we’re talking today, you recently finished the last issue of Angel: After the Fall. How’s that feel?

BL: I think I finished the last issue on Christmas Day and I took a week break and I thought, “I’m not going to have to do that again for months. And then,

200

___________________________________ Angel: Old Friends art by David Messina.

I just told Chris two or three days ago that I wrote eight or nine pages of an Angel book. I had an idea and I thought, “I have to do this.” I wanted to get it on paper. And Chris said, “You can’t quit us.” And I said, “I know.” I love these characters.

TA: That’s great news. We can’t wait to have you back. The door here is wide open and not just for Angel, but for whatever you’d like to do. Although we’re certainly anxious to have you back on Angel and Spike.

BL: Thank you so much, that’s cool.

IDW

_________________________________ Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

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