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The Buzzoodle Interviews Ron Finklestein interviewed by Ron McDaniel Transcript Topic:

Growing Sales and Revenue Ron McDaniel: Hi, this is Ron McDaniel and today I am here talking to Ron Finklestein of RPF Group Inc. Ron and I go back a long way. We go back 10 years and interestingly I think we both started in technology, and we are both in sales and marketing now. So we both evolved over the years. Ron and I talk regularly and a little while back he was kind of getting tired and loosing his mojo a little. He discovered some interesting things about his diet. Before we get into how to grow your sales in marketing, Ron how do you feel now that you've switched up your diet? Ron Finklestein: Oh Ron, I am feeling great. It turned out that I've taken all gluten out of my diet. It turns out that my body is resistant to gluten. And as a result, my energy level is back up and the aches and pains that I had are gone. My migraine headaches are gone, and I just feel that I have a new lease on life. So I am excited about it. Ron McDaniel: Well you've got a couple of international books, published in different countries, so is another one of those in the works now? Ron Finklestein: I've got three of them in the works. Part of that is my energy level is so high; I've bitten off more than I can chew. I'm going to have to peel back two of them for the time being, and just focus on one to get it done. But I really like where my productivity is going, so this is good stuff. Ron McDaniel: With all the productivity books on the market you would think that they would address diet a little bit more. Ways of having your task list and such. Diet can play a huge role in that as well, can't it? Ron Finklestein: Well you know what I found. When I wasn't feeling really well, my energy level was way down, and I didn't want to do anything. And for me there is a real correlation between how I feel physically and what I want to do mentally. So when I started to get some of the physical stuff out of the way, my mental state got really recharged, really rejuvenated. And that was a connection, I had never drawn. One thing that entrepreneurs really have to take into account is their health. Because if they don't take care of their health, it affects their mental attitude, big time.

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Ron McDaniel: So it's really interesting Ron, how changing your diet, can change your productivity. Even though we are going to be talking about how to improve sales and marketing, that's a really important point. It's like having an extra employee, if you can double your productivity by feeling well and taking care of yourself. Would you agree with that? Ron Finklestein: I would totally agree with that. What I found is that my mental attitude was being reflected by not feeling well. Once I started to feel well physically, my mental attitude improved tremendously. And as a result of that, I was able to get more focused. And once I got more focused on the important things, the less important things kind of fell away. My productivity has gone way up.

Ron McDaniel: They always talk about productivity. That has to help sales, just being on the phone and feeling better. Ron Finklestein: Ron, I can't begin to tell you the power of attitude in the sales call. When you go into a sales call, and you are confident, and you understand your product and your value proposition. That communicates more to a conscious level, than on a subconscious level. Than what you communicate on a verbal level. Because verbal communication that happens on a consciously or subconsciously level is very enormous. Ron McDaniel: Interesting. O.k. let's get started. We are going to be talking for about 20 minutes on how to improve sales or beats revenue. And not necessarily specifically internet related, but those kinds of stuff applies in both areas, because eventually, if you are sailing a complex sale, you are going to end up on the phone, conversing with people. Why don't you kind of set things up. What are the core things we are going to be talking about? Ron Finklestein: Well there are really 3 problems and these 3 problems are consistent across the board from internet marketing to lead generation. If you are using the internet to actually doing your sales presentations, or even if you are marketing for instance on a direct mail sales piece. Or advertising of some sort. The 3 biggest problems that I see are in terms of having companies revenues to increase sales across the board. They confuse sales and don't really understand what the difference is between sales and blend them. The other problem is they don't communicate effectively their value proposition. And what I mean by that is when you are sitting their and talking to somebody, and you are trying to figure out why you might buy from them. They are talking about how good they are and how many

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customers they have. And all those types of things that are important after they have a reason to talk to you. And the third thing is they don't know how to price properly. Because they let their beliefs and expectations get in the way. They very well may see somebody and say, “oh he doesn't have any money� And I have to say I am guilty of this, I did a sales presentation and it was a good presentation and I decided not to go over the pricing in the presentation, because I didn't think the person I was presenting to could afford it. And she asked me why do you have pricing on this? And I said yes I do would you like to see it? So I gave her the pricing and when she gets back from her trip, she is going to join me at the highest level of my coaching program. So we got to get our beliefs out of the way, and not assume that we understand why people are buying from us, or what they can afford. Ron McDaniel: That kind of gets down to that, give them a chance to say no sort of thing. Ron Finklestein: That's exactly right .One of the things in the value proposition and if we use for example internet marketing. If you are not clearing your value proposition, then you can not communicate it effectively over the internet. Now the only media you have are the words that you use. So you have to be very concise about how you do that. That same method of analogy is used for example when you are doing a direct mail piece. And it's actually the same thing that you use when you are speaking to somebody. So what we are talking about works in all methods of growing sales. Ron McDaniel: O.k great. The first core topic we are going to talk about is the difference between sales and marketing. Can you give me a little more detail there and also maybe an example of where you fix somebody's confusion, and it turned into a big success for them. Ron Finklestein: Yeah it's interesting. Just before we got on the phone, I was meeting with a prospect and I asked the question. I said Andrea, what from your prospective is the difference between sales and marketing? And she does website design and development. She goes, you know I really can't answer that. I said, here's the simple version. The simple version is marketing is who you're buying from, why they buy from you, what's your value proposition, where you find them, where their pains are and how you solve those pains. In fact the demographic and the psychographic profile of your buyer or your customer that you are selling to. Sales are the implementation of all the work you've done in marketing. So if you go out in the marketing side and say these are the kinds of customers I work with, these are the pains that I solve, these are the problems I solve, this is why you need to buy from us. This is why we are the right choice. When you move into the sales process, sales doesn't support everything you've done on the marketing side, then you've created a disconnect between what you are doing and what your buyers are expecting. So the marketing is in fact all the heavy lifting that's required for the sales process to be successful.

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Ron McDaniel: And when you are working with someone, do you typically go incrementally or do you revamp their entire thing, as far as marketing goes? Ron Finklestein: It depends on where they are at. I got some people that have some really good marketing programs in place, but they are not producing. That's because there are just some keywords that need to be switched around a little bit. The power of changing one word in some marketing strategies can be absolutely extraordinary. So it depends on where they are at. Some people come to me and they are getting in front of enough people, but they are not closing anything. Because they don't know what to do in front of the sales process. Because they haven't done the marketing. They have a knack of being in front of people, but not closing anything. Then I have other people that. I'll give you an example. I closed one customer that is going to join me she is an accountant. She kept saying “I am just not confident” and the more I listened to her, the more I realized, that it wasn't just that she was lacking confidence, she is a very indirect individual and she was afraid of confrontation. So consequently her whole structure was designed to qualify everything before she even gave them the news. By that time, people were already long gone and had lost interest. I helped her understand that you are not lacking confidence, because you obviously know what you are doing. You are trying to do what you perceive as an uncomfortable situation, by someone getting mad at you. And once she saw that you could see her eyes lighting up and she said “you know what, you are right.” She sat up straighter, she looked more comfortable, she looked more confident and I knew right then and there that we had made a big inroad into her thinking. That's an example of how simple it can be. Ron McDaniel: That's an example of how she didn't know how to test close. I can remember, when I first started, it was very new. Someone interrupted me halfway through and he said here's the church card, just sign me up, you don't need to keep sailing. Probably I was guilty of the same thing. It was a new product, I wasn't comfortable with it. I kept talking too long. Ron Finklestein: Well in her case, she called me and said, I am not charging what I am worth. She said, when people challenge me on the price, I just lower the price. Because she was afraid, if she stood her ground on price, then she was creating a potential conflict, which she was trying to avoid. She hadn't defined the value to the customer. All she's got to do is define the value to the customer for the design structure, and then that issue will go away. I've seen it a thousand different times. Pricing only becomes an issue, when you don't communicate the value. Ron McDaniel: Right. Good point. We are going to go on to the next section. How a business can help understand the value proposition I mean really get into the meat of what you are talking about there. What do you do when you are working with a new client? How do you assess their value

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proposition and what do you look for to make improvements? Ron Finklestein: There are 6 questions that I evaluate every marketing, every value proposition from. And these 6 questions have been developed over many years of testing in terms of what works, what doesn't work. Because of the length of our call Ron, I don't have time to get into all 6. Let's talk about just 2 of them. The first one is, let's pretend for just a moment that we are at a networking event, and someone comes up to me and they say Ron, nice to meet you, what do you do? And I could say well I do sales and marketing consulting. Oh and that's great, and then they are off to something else. What I just described to them is the sales and marketing consulting is how I do things, it's not what I do. So what I've learned over the years is when someone asks what do I do, what I tell them is that I help companies grow sales, increase sales revenue and increase sales. What that answer is really designed to do, is tell people what they will experience when they work with me, not how I do it. And that's the very first step in the sales process. So unless you understand the outcome people experience when working with you, it's very hard to build your value proposition. Ron McDaniel: Well even in the web, we have, it's so obvious, but you have to think the visitor, the searcher, the prospect and what they are looking for, not what you want to sell them. I think that is the same thing, just in different words. Ron Finklestein: It actually is. When those 6 questions was developed, I had a meeting with the marketing guy and I asked him either you really want my money or you want access to the database. Tell me why do people buy from you. He couldn't answer that. I said let me ask the question in a different way. What outcomes do people experience when they work with you? And he couldn't answer that. I finally said, who is your ideal client?. And he couldn't answer that. I said ok, how many customers do you have. He said 300. I said as a financial guy are you looking for day planners buying hold, are you looking for people looking to buy mutual funds, people who want to do stocks, can you manage portfolios? Help me out here, will you. I came to realize that is the single biggest problem that all of us have. We expect people to understand what we are saying well enough, that we can interpret it to what it means to us. And we can't. We have to be very clear and say this is why it is important to you. Ron McDaniel: If they could understand it, it is probably because they do it themselves also. So they are probably not a good prospect. Ron Finklestein: It is. One of the things I teach all my clients is, I have a simple test. If they say something, I say so what. And it's not designed to be mean, it's just simply so what. And if there is more behind that so what, then I know they are not done. So then when we get to that last so what, it like oh I

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get it. That makes sense. It's a very simple process to go through, but it requires that you think from your customers' prospective, not from yours. You indicate to your customers the way that they want to be communicated to. Don't make them think. Don't make them work. Ron McDaniel: Right, good advice. You were going to share the 2nd question with us as well. What was that one. Ron Finklestein: Thank you for reminding me. The second question is, why is what you do important to me. So when I tell people that I help companies grow in sales increase revenues in the sales process. The reason that's important to you, is that it puts you in control of the revenue generating part of your business. So most people don't have control over where they sell, where their customers come from, how you close them, who is the ideal prospect. All we are going to do is put you in control of that. That's another process. So when people say what do you do. Don't make me think about it. Don't tell me you are a bookkeeper, or an accountant because that's what you do. Tell them why you are the bookkeeper I need to work with, or the accountant I need to work with. Tell me why that's important to me. Ron McDaniel: We are not going to get into the final 4 questions. You are going to tell them where they can go to get them for free, correct? Ron Finklestein: Yes. We have a website they can go to and download them for free. It tells you what the six questions are, why they are important and gives you a process on how to answer them, so you can do this yourself, if you want to. Ron McDaniel: You wrote a whole book on this also correct? Ron Finklestein: I have a book ready. I have a book called 49 marketing secrets that work to grow sales. And it's been translated into 5 languages. It's a big part of the sales marketing work that I do. But the only documentation that I have right now is the white paper. That is one of my projects, turning that white pages into a full blown book. Ron McDaniel: Ok. We have one other question we are going to ask you. Wanted to make sure we had time to cover, what is holding people back from achieving their goals? Ron Finklestein: I love working with people because when we get clear on what is important to them, they start thinking clear and do some marvelous, marvelous things. There are 4 things that set people back. Most people don't set goals believe it or not. I was with a woman today who has a massage business, and she wants her husband into the business, and she doesn't know how to do it.

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I said how much do you need to generate in order to bring your husband in. I don't really know. How many customers do you need to get, so you can bring your husband into the business. I don't really know. What is your husband going to do when he comes into the business, I don't really know. Just asking her those three questions, got her crystalized on the fact, that she doesn't have a solid business plan or goal, that she is working towards. So once we get that goal set, one of the things we want to do is get real clear on your purpose for doing it. Why is it important, cause it's the energy, the emotion that gets us up in the morning when things get hard. It's that big why that is so important. Another thing that we have to talk about is what is our reason we believe we can do it? Most of us set these big, hairy, audacious goals. Then we look at them and intimidate ourselves and don't do anything. What we've got to get clear on, is we've all achieved things that we thought we would never achieve. And we've got to be clear. Perfect example, I have a woman working with me now, who set a big goal, and she was intimidated by it. And I asked her what is the most important goal that you've accomplished in your life so far? graduated from the school of journalism. That was the most grueling process I have went through. If you went through that, you can do this. She looked at it as another thing I can do. Another thing we have to get clear on is the action steps to implement it. We have to make sure that a goal with out any actions set is simply a dream. Simply wish. We have to put the action steps in place. And manage to those action steps. Those are the 3 things, that hold people back. They don't know why they are doing it. They don't have the reason to believe they can do it. And then they don't put the steps in place to make it happen. Ron McDaniel: Interesting, You know what do you think of people just having too many goals. I find that I have the opposite problem. I usually have too many. Ron Finklestein: You know I put together my process Ron, with another book I am working on called 90days to massive results. I did that to set it up with in 90 days you can accomplish darn near anything. I set it up with 5 goals, and when I went through the process I was overwhelmed with the amount of work I was doing. I couldn't keep up. I peeled it back to one or two goals that drive a specific purpose. What I call enlighten self interest. And once I got really clear on enlighten self interest and the one or two goals that support that, then my reason to believe I could do those, then things got real simple. I knew what I was going to do everyday and decisions got really easy for me to make, because when someone presented an opportunity to me, if it wasn't consistent with my enlightened self interest, I wasn't doing it. So things got very simple very quickly.

Ron McDaniel: Great. Well I appreciate you coming on and helping us with these issues. Any one listening to this, it gives them a lot to think about when marketing. Plus maybe their sales process and sales team you want to tell us a little more about where to go and get the 6 questions report. It's

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www.businessgrowthexperience.com Correct? Ron Finkelstein: One word. businessgrowthexperience.com and what you will see is an opt in box. Just give me your name, your email address, and if you'd like me to call you put in your telephone number. You will get a confirmation email, to make sure it's not robots filling it out. Once you confirm, you will get a 55 page report that talks about the 6 questions and how people use it. It will take you through a process of how to develop your own. I to offer the first 5 listener's who are serious a free session. All they have to do is send an email to ron@businessgrowthexperience with the word assessment so I know what it is about. leave a telephone number, so I can reach you and time zone. Ron McDaniel: If you are hearing this after the fact, still contact Ron anyways.

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